Puff of smoke when slowing down in gear then accelerating...

milloman

Member +
Hi all,

Not sure what this issue could be, but hopefully i can give enough info for you to give me a bit of an idea...

EP91 glanza, running a TD04 turbo setup which was all done last year, other mods include...

- decat
- wepr mani
- sard 330cc injectors
- walb fuel pump
- sard rrfpr
- hks fcd

i'm not sure if i've got them all in there or not i'll have to take a look at my mods list again (not had the car long!)

Basically, this issue only happens when the engine is warm... say if i'm slowing down for a roundabout... if i downshift to say 3rd gear (not specific to any gear!) and the engine slows me down from say 3500-4000rpm down to about 2000rpm (without using the brakes!), if i then accelerate, still in 3rd gear, i'll get quite a large puff of smoke as soon as i blip the accelerator. Colour of smoke is white/grey i'd say.

Only thing to mention is that i've recently had the rocker cover gasket replaced TWICE because it was leaking oil... then the one toyota fitted was faulty and pissed oil everywhere, so they've now replaced it, but on my first 20 miles its still doing it. Supposing it still does it after i've driven it for a while... what could it be? boosts fine @ standard boost, i do get a bit of smoke if i rag it, but perhaps this is normal?

Any thoughts/suggestions guys? :) if you need any more info just ask...

Cheers!!
 

350ep70gr

Member +
worn valve seals or turbo or blocked ventilation on the crank case. If smoke was continious over rpm is more piston rings or cylinder worn in any way.Black smoke is more overfuell. White smoke is burnt oil.blue(or something like that colour)is probably a mix with coolant. Hope it helps.
 

milloman

Member +
worn valve seals or turbo or blocked ventilation on the crank case. If smoke was continious over rpm is more piston rings or cylinder worn in any way.Black smoke is more overfuell. White smoke is burnt oil.blue(or something like that colour)is probably a mix with coolant. Hope it helps.

Cheers, smoke is definately not continuous over rpm, only when i decelerate in gear then accelerate again. so potentially some kind of seal... whats the best way to diagnose where there problem lies?
 

milloman

Member +
its not oil stuck in your exhaust?

Well you see this is the other possibility... i've actually got a buddyclub spec 2 exhaust which i'm going to fit this weekend and see if it makes a difference at all, if it still does it i'll know its coming from higher that the exhaust and its completely unrelated to the previous oil leak and something is still leaking/burning... i will find out this on saturday when i fit the new one :) but like a panicked owner i wanted to see what else it could be if this doesn't solve it, lol.
 

350ep70gr

Member +
When decelarate with gear you have more vacum in your engine and if worn valve seals oil is force to come in the runners and the cylinders.This amount of oil is burnt and blow out as white smoke when you just press the gas petal. For diagnose worn cylinder -piston ring do a compression test. And usually when piston rings are gone you have smoke when engine is warm through the ventilation of the top cover.
 

Chris@CCM

Member +
wore valve stem seals it could be tho the way ur saying about blowing rocker cover gaskets i would say ur pcv valve on ur rocker cover might not be working 100% or u might have a problem with blow by as in a broken piston or rings . ive changed manny broken pistons and there cars all drove fine so just keep that in mind. dose the car put any oil over the breather on the rocker cover ?
 

milloman

Member +
When decelarate with gear you have more vacum in your engine and if worn valve seals oil is force to come in the runners and the cylinders.This amount of oil is burnt and blow out as white smoke when you just press the gas petal. For diagnose worn cylinder -piston ring do a compression test. And usually when piston rings are gone you have smoke when engine is warm through the ventilation of the top cover.

Interesting... so if when the engine is hot, i quickly take out the dipstick, i should see smoke?

i'll have to go and get it compression tested too...
 

milloman

Member +
wore valve stem seals it could be tho the way ur saying about blowing rocker cover gaskets i would say ur pcv valve on ur rocker cover might not be working 100% or u might have a problem with blow by as in a broken piston or rings . ive changed manny broken pistons and there cars all drove fine so just keep that in mind. dose the car put any oil over the breather on the rocker cover ?

I *think* (not an expert on this) that the breather on the rocker cover is going off into an oil catch can (?) i'll get a picture of it for you to see, but i've never seen any oil in the pip that takes it to the can (its a seethru one).

So it looks like a compression test is needed... if so, should one piston be replaced or all? And if i'm doing that, should i be considering going forged for the sake of it, considering it'll have to be taken apart?
 

Chris@CCM

Member +
I *think* (not an expert on this) that the breather on the rocker cover is going off into an oil catch can (?) i'll get a picture of it for you to see, but i've never seen any oil in the pip that takes it to the can (its a seethru one).

So it looks like a compression test is needed... if so, should one piston be replaced or all? And if i'm doing that, should i be considering going forged for the sake of it, considering it'll have to be taken apart?
i got mixed up on threads hear lol but i still think it could be ur turbo or pcv vlave mabby valve stem seals
 
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Fishy89GT

Banned
i had this problem.. depends if your smoke is blue or white?! white generall indicates your turbo is fooked.. blue meaning oil is being burnt.. my problem was when i lifted of and re accelerated after changing gear.. i believe my problem was valve stem oil seals or the oil seals in the tubro.. get it checked and do not run the car.. or it will / can cause serious problems.. piston & ring damage and wear.. this is what happen to me.. i learnt from it :)
 

milloman

Member +
i had this problem.. depends if your smoke is blue or white?! white generall indicates your turbo is fooked.. blue meaning oil is being burnt.. my problem was when i lifted of and re accelerated after changing gear.. i believe my problem was valve stem oil seals or the oil seals in the tubro.. get it checked and do not run the car.. or it will / can cause serious problems.. piston & ring damage and wear.. this is what happen to me.. i learnt from it :)

FORTUNATELY i've got a really old and batty (albeit legendary...) Mazda 323 becoming available in the family for me to run, so i shall now definitely NOT drive the glanza after tomorrow. i'll get it checked out asap.

Anyone have a response to my last couple of Q's? :) (comp test givin the me the diagnosis and the Q about going forged)

either way it'll be another big bill... :( oh man! only had it about 2 months :( my last glanza gave me a year or expense free driving!
 

Chris@CCM

Member +
its up to u buddy if only one psiton is broken i would only change 1 . if u want to go forged go for it but to do it rite ur talking about 2k . check all out the other things too it may not be pistons at all
 

milloman

Member +
its up to u buddy if only one psiton is broken i would only change 1 . if u want to go forged go for it but to do it rite ur talking about 2k . check all out the other things too it may not be pistons at all

Cool cheers buddy :) i'll get it checked out and see what comes back, fingers are definately crossed - i don't have a spare £2k! any idea what it'd cost for a replacement piston? And how long of labour i'd expect to pay for from someone that knows what they're doing?

Cheers again :)
 

GTti

Member +
My input:

Smoke with blue tinge: This would indicate oil is more combusted than burning. The oil could be getting combusted for a number of reasons. Piston rings or piston damage, or worn bores. Oil leaking turbo compressor (intake) side. Perhaps oil past valve seals on the intake side. Excessive crank case pressure pushing oil into engine breather.

White smoke: This would usually indicate the oil is burning (not being combusted). This could be oil leaking exhaust side of the turbo into the exhaust. Oil leaking onto valve seals exhaust side. Coolant (Head gasket).

Black smoke: AFR. Unburnt fuel. Possible bore wash if excessive (Which could lead to contaminated oil > damaged bearings > blown engine)


In your case I think oil is burning somewhere. It's obviously possible to have a combination of issues though.
I'd inspect your turbo for any deposits of oil in the exhaust and intake. Perform a compression test to ensure the health of your engine.

From logic I'd say valve seals are least likely, it needs more time to leak past the valves. More diagnosable on HOT starts where oil is thin enough to seep through and valves (some) are open.

Go from there.
 
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milloman

Member +
My input:

Smoke with blue tinge: This would indicate oil is more combusted than burning. The oil could be getting combusted for a number of reasons. Piston rings or piston damage, or worn bores. Oil leaking turbo compressor (intake) side. Perhaps oil past valve seals on the intake side. Excessive crank case pressure pushing oil into engine breather.

White smoke: This would usually indicate the oil is burning (not being combusted). This could be oil leaking exhaust side of the turbo into the exhaust. Oil leaking onto valve seals exhaust side. Coolant (Head gasket).

Black smoke: AFR. Unburnt fuel. Possible bore wash if excessive (Which could lead to contaminated oil > damaged bearings > blown engine)


In your case I think oil is burning somewhere. It's obviously possible to have a combination of issues though.
I'd inspect your turbo for any deposits of oil in the exhaust and intake. Perform a compression test to ensure the health of your engine.

From logic I'd say valve seals are least likely, it needs more time to leak past the valves. More diagnosable on HOT starts where oil is thin enough to seep through and valves (some) are open.

Go from there.



Wahey another MK-ite!!! do you know a good place near us that'd be able to help out? I was planning on trying Marlin Motors in bletchley..
 

Chris@CCM

Member +
Cool cheers buddy :) i'll get it checked out and see what comes back, fingers are definately crossed - i don't have a spare £2k! any idea what it'd cost for a replacement piston? And how long of labour i'd expect to pay for from someone that knows what they're doing?

Cheers again :)
a piston off toyota is around 40 pounds each then a set of rings at 70 tho that dose all 4 pistons. it should not take more then 10 hours ive done them in a lot less
 

GTti

Member +
Didn't see you were from MK there!

I've never taken any of my cars to a garage in MK apart from MOT stations. Always done work myself! I'd assume almost any garage can help you perform a compression test and various other health checks to try and locate the problem though.

You can also buy a compression tester from Halfords if you want to do that part yourself.
 

milloman

Member +
a piston off toyota is around 40 pounds each then a set of rings at 70 tho that dose all 4 pistons. it should not take more then 10 hours ive done them in a lot less

Ok so 10 hours at most on labour (ish)... for that amount of labour, would it take much longer to do all four? See, parts isn't the issue here its labour, the labour rate is so high in this country that's what makes a bill nowadays, not the parts :( from my experience anyway!
 

stedee

Member +
if it is your pistons which i doubt - souns more like valve oil seals or turbo - go forged - youve got a td04 setup which needs forged pistons to use its full potential
 
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