Freedom of Speech - I finally got my answer!

gv1.3

Admin
Hi all,

I was recently back in Ireland for a week and when walking through the city centre in Dublin I spotted a desk setup outside the GPO (general post office) on O' Connell Street. For those not from Ireland this place holds a great deal of historic significance as it was the starting point of the Easter Rising in 1916.

Anyway, the desk had a banner hanging in front of it promoting Islam and two lads standing behind it. I advised my better half to go in to one of the shops and I would follow her in. When she was gone I went over to chat to the two lads.

I began by politely introducing myself and they politely responded and within 2 or 3 minutes had referred to me as "brother" several times. The desk was full of leaflets with information about various aspects of the Muslim faith. A couple that stood out were "Shari-ah Law and you" and another which had pictures of very happy smiling women adorning its front which was entitled "Islam and Womens rights".

I asked the lads what they thought about my country being such a free society that we would allow them to openly promote their religion without fear of backlash. They agreed that it was great. I asked them how they felt that if I went to an Islamic republic and set up a table promoting my religion in front of one of their most historic buildings I would not be allowed to and would most probably be jailed. They nervously smiled, nodded and began trying to talk to other people who were walking by.

I continued....

I advised them that I thought Shari-ah law should be enforced for Muslims in my country, they beamed and informed me "that is what we want". I further informed them that then we could potentially round them up off the streets and brutally punish them for silly crimes, perhaps even for setting up the desk outside the GPO. They nervously laughed...

They began quoting references from their holy book at me. At this point a small crowd had gathered as the conversation had began to get a little bit loud. I informed the two lads that I had no interest in hearing them quote passages at me but would rather them answer a simple question.

I asked them "do you consider me to be your equal?". I received another round of passages which I stopped in their tracks again and asked again "do you consider me to be your equal?"

Having asked the question several times and not received a yes or no the crowd had grown bigger. The two lads informed me that their prophet had lived beside a Jew... "he had a Jew neighbour" they said. I asked "and do you consider that Jew to be your prophets equal?", they continued to dodge the question.

After about 5 minutes of me asking the same question I said "you refuse to answer yes or no in front of these people, say yes or say no". Having put them on the spot I asked the question again "as a non-Muslim do you consider me to be your equal?".

He answered - "No"

I said "and that is the problem with your religion, do not refer to me as brother again"

I walked off. This was a very interesting experience for me and I am glad I took the time to go and talk to them.
 

Iain@CRD

Lifer
This is a touchy subject for me as i personally have strongs beliefs in these cases. I think you were completely right to question it, its far too easily branded "racist" to use an escape goat to get out of answering these questions.
 

HYBRID

Super Moderator <a href="http://www.toyotagtturbo.
well u know how that good old saying goes:

"All are equal....... but some are more equal than others" ;)

well done for putting them on the spot dylan, im actually amazed that they answered u in the end!!!

kon
 

starbuck

Member +
Not a lot of people would have done what you did. Like mentioned above, So far play for questioning them about it.
 

gv1.3

Admin
I have personally being attempting to educate myself with regard to the teachings of Islam, its not easy as you read something that sounds a bit aggressive but them followers will tell you that you are taking the wrong meaning from it etc.

I have heard so many times that Islam teaches its followers that non-muslims are not equals and many more bad things about non-muslims which for the purpose of this thread I dont think we need to go in to.

When I saw these lads I thought it was a perfect time to find out for myself and so I asked them. It took a lot to get a direct answer from them. It was the younger of the two who answered me and he was quickly spoken to by the older man with him in an effort to hush him up.

I am not trying to stir it up and would like this thread kept civil but I think its very interesting that Muslims love the ability to freely speak out about their religion yet are calling for the same laws to be enacted in our countries which would prevent them from publicly protesting and remove their freedom of speech, kinda ironic...

Anyway I was disappointed that more Irish people were not questioning these lads. And for the record had it been a Catholic church stand I would have went and asked them to explain themselves regarding their institution facilitating child rape.
 

FeNder

Member +
i think its great that you went ahead and asked them and spoke your mind ,
only one thing pisses me off about those guys in the stand , is that they know nothing lol ,
if they were so informed to the point of quoting you passages a few times ,
they should've known the passage that essentially means :
all men are created equal , and the only thing that makes me different from you , from him , from her , from whoever , is how good you are inside and how you treat others . NOT RELATED TO YOUR FAITH .

And therefore , i have to say , they were right in saying you were not equal , its coz u were better than them not vice versa , their first mistake was thinking they were better than others , and it is said that no one can think that for whatever reason . if they dont know solid info they shouldnt be at that stand !
 
Hi all,

I was recently back in Ireland for a week and when walking through the city centre in Dublin I spotted a desk setup outside the GPO (general post office) on O' Connell Street. For those not from Ireland this place holds a great deal of historic significance as it was the starting point of the Easter Rising in 1916.

Anyway, the desk had a banner hanging in front of it promoting Islam and two lads standing behind it. I advised my better half to go in to one of the shops and I would follow her in. When she was gone I went over to chat to the two lads.

I began by politely introducing myself and they politely responded and within 2 or 3 minutes had referred to me as "brother" several times. The desk was full of leaflets with information about various aspects of the Muslim faith. A couple that stood out were "Shari-ah Law and you" and another which had pictures of very happy smiling women adorning its front which was entitled "Islam and Womens rights".

I asked the lads what they thought about my country being such a free society that we would allow them to openly promote their religion without fear of backlash. They agreed that it was great. I asked them how they felt that if I went to an Islamic republic and set up a table promoting my religion in front of one of their most historic buildings I would not be allowed to and would most probably be jailed. They nervously smiled, nodded and began trying to talk to other people who were walking by.

I continued....

I advised them that I thought Shari-ah law should be enforced for Muslims in my country, they beamed and informed me "that is what we want". I further informed them that then we could potentially round them up off the streets and brutally punish them for silly crimes, perhaps even for setting up the desk outside the GPO. They nervously laughed...

They began quoting references from their holy book at me. At this point a small crowd had gathered as the conversation had began to get a little bit loud. I informed the two lads that I had no interest in hearing them quote passages at me but would rather them answer a simple question.

I asked them "do you consider me to be your equal?". I received another round of passages which I stopped in their tracks again and asked again "do you consider me to be your equal?"

Having asked the question several times and not received a yes or no the crowd had grown bigger. The two lads informed me that their prophet had lived beside a Jew... "he had a Jew neighbour" they said. I asked "and do you consider that Jew to be your prophets equal?", they continued to dodge the question.

After about 5 minutes of me asking the same question I said "you refuse to answer yes or no in front of these people, say yes or say no". Having put them on the spot I asked the question again "as a non-Muslim do you consider me to be your equal?".

He answered - "No"

I said "and that is the problem with your religion, do not refer to me as brother again"

I walked off. This was a very interesting experience for me and I am glad I took the time to go and talk to them.

I dont no much about the thread in question but so happy that you had the balls to ask them what ever was on your mind and yea got the question you wanted good on yea m8...
 

gv1.3

Admin
i think its great that you went ahead and asked them and spoke your mind ,
only one thing pisses me off about those guys in the stand , is that they know nothing lol ,
if they were so informed to the point of quoting you passages a few times ,
they should've known the passage that essentially means :
all men are created equal , and the only thing that makes me different from you , from him , from her , from whoever , is how good you are inside and how you treat others . NOT RELATED TO YOUR FAITH .

And therefore , i have to say , they were right in saying you were not equal , its coz u were better than them not vice versa , their first mistake was thinking they were better than others , and it is said that no one can think that for whatever reason . if they dont know solid info they shouldnt be at that stand !


Fender mate I agree with everything you said above. I have moved on from my initial take on Islam. I still do not agree with how it is preached to its followers in general given some of the evidence I have seen. That said however I am trying to treat each person as an individual. If the lads at the stand had said "everyone is equal and deserves respect until they prove otherwise" then I would have respected that. But they basically told me that because I am not a muslim I am not their equal.

The majority of Muslims I have encountered however stick to the general line and will not give their own opinion, you have always seemed a free thinker to me but unfortunately more are not like you.
 

FeNder

Member +
i know what you mean , treating everyone as an individual and respecting until proven otherwise is the core of being a good honest person .

what they told you , means this in TGTT language :

im running 300WHP on a stock GT with a Hks Fcd LOL !
 

Phil

Super Moderator
i know what you mean , treating everyone as an individual and respecting until proven otherwise is the core of being a good honest person .

what they told you , means this in TGTT language :

im running 300WHP on a stock GT with a Hks Fcd LOL !

but its all to do with location.

sharia law works some places. just as well as 300whp on a stock gt is possible with a ct9 in jamaica. lol

Phil
 

addz

Member +
Fair play to your patriotic, chauvinism, jingoism approach. I see within the small towns I travel between similar balderdash. These so called stall standings can always without question promote the wrong information, and many of who recruit the not so wise. How authentic some of these religion stalls are is beyond me, but I never believe in them. The information ANY human being gives can take two possible turns, to be correct or not correct. Some may call you brother, son, sheep, shepard and any other word in the same relation.

I respect your bravery whether it was out of heard or principle, but these stalls will inevitably persist. Whether it's a what seems to be mainsteam Islamic stall, Jew, Christian, Catholic, Scientology, Paganism and whatever else might be under the wood work.

These stalls should be questioned, and if the being, the divine individual objects to answer your humble question, don't blame the religion, but the person promoting it. This can in most cases be the issue and us, the beings of humankind can interpret bad names upon the religion.
 
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