Ecu question
- Thread starter Badmoon
- Start date
gorganl2000
Lifer
this is not a direct reply to your question, but nonetheless
i once ran a JAM ecu, then later on hooked up emanage ultimate (EMU)...we tried tuning with the set up for a very short period,,,it could be tuned, but they seemed to fight more with each other to get the tuning done...probably due to the additional board on the preprogrammed ecu, the emu (piggyback), and stock ecu all trying to have a say in the final output...in this case, the less variables the better
we then took out the JAM ecu and installed the stock ECU with the EMU,,,this seemed to be easier to tune
the end result --- because the EMU was tunable, it made no difference which ECU we ran....so i kept the stock ecu and EMU in the car and sold the JAM ecu
the EMU allows tuning of both fuel and ignition--which is a good thing from a piggyback
now the HKS PFC F-CON, if i remember correctly only tunes fuel????---if so, then you may be able to clean up your fuel map, but your ignition will still be whatever is on the preprogrammed jdm ecu, which could be some thing to consider depending on your fuel quality, region, etc.
without knowing the specifics of your situation --- my initial suggestion is to get something that tunes both fuel and ignition (piggyback or standalone)
i once ran a JAM ecu, then later on hooked up emanage ultimate (EMU)...we tried tuning with the set up for a very short period,,,it could be tuned, but they seemed to fight more with each other to get the tuning done...probably due to the additional board on the preprogrammed ecu, the emu (piggyback), and stock ecu all trying to have a say in the final output...in this case, the less variables the better
we then took out the JAM ecu and installed the stock ECU with the EMU,,,this seemed to be easier to tune
the end result --- because the EMU was tunable, it made no difference which ECU we ran....so i kept the stock ecu and EMU in the car and sold the JAM ecu
the EMU allows tuning of both fuel and ignition--which is a good thing from a piggyback
now the HKS PFC F-CON, if i remember correctly only tunes fuel????---if so, then you may be able to clean up your fuel map, but your ignition will still be whatever is on the preprogrammed jdm ecu, which could be some thing to consider depending on your fuel quality, region, etc.
without knowing the specifics of your situation --- my initial suggestion is to get something that tunes both fuel and ignition (piggyback or standalone)
Badmoon
Member +
Thanks for answering my question!
Yeah was also thinking they might try to overlap each other, not a good idea.
I'll be keeping the preprogrammed ECU connected then, I trust it more to do the whole engine management to the stock ECU + HKS PFC F-CON combo, I only have an hybrid CT9 at 1.1bar. Also the preprogrammed ECU removes fuel cut, speed limit and raises my top RPM a bit, with the HKS combo I don't have nothing of this.
I only use Premium 98 fuel in my car and I live in Portugal.
gorganl2000
Lifer
maybe you can try them together (preprogrammed ecu and HKS PFC F-CON) and see what happens...just make very small adjustment changes and check, then make small adjustments again and recheck, and keep repeating that cycle
IF you do this, please get a wide band sensor to monitor the air fuel ratios and something to detect knock
knock cans (the DIY ones seem to work and are cheap to make) or other electronic detonation detection devices (this is the more expensive option)
IF you do this, please get a wide band sensor to monitor the air fuel ratios and something to detect knock
knock cans (the DIY ones seem to work and are cheap to make) or other electronic detonation detection devices (this is the more expensive option)
Badmoon
Member +
Don't know if its worth it... I always tuned the HKS PFC F-CON with the EGT gauge as stated in its manual and the fueling was always rich, I don't own a wideband and don't know anyone who I can borrow from, they are not cheap around here...
So best to just keep the preprogrammed ECU in control, I know its also running rich with it from the EGT readings.
Thanks again!
Badmoon
Member +
Exactly what I'm thinking. The engine has more power and reaction since I installed the preprogrammed ECU. My question was only to know if there would be any gains/benefits from pairing it with the HKS PFC F-CON. I'm okay with what I have now, never had my car better then this before.
WhiteOverGoldMK1GT
Member +
This here is the best advice possible for starlets. Plain and simple.
Badmoon
Member +
True!
Already had my (big) share of problems with this engine (10 years now) and the last thing I want is trouble again since it is working so nice now.
Of course we all chase for a bit more performance and my question was only to know what this combo would do and if it would get something more of the engine.
Glad for all your opinions on this!
gorganl2000
Lifer
plug and play ecus are known to run very rich,,,like the stock ecu,,,so i suspect you won't have to worry about any lean conditions
and i can agree, if it's working as it is, then leave it alone
PS --however, on a side note, there is power to be made from running the correct air fuel ratios IF your car is running excessively rich
and i can agree, if it's working as it is, then leave it alone
PS --however, on a side note, there is power to be made from running the correct air fuel ratios IF your car is running excessively rich
gorganl2000
Lifer
yeah, i know all about how expensive things are to acquire...
the wideband is a nice piece of equipment to have on these cars though, maybe save up and get yourself one in the future
Badmoon
Member +
Yeah I agree with you and I'm also a bit curious to know what my AFR is at the moment. Will add the wideband to my buying list, just to get an idea of what really is going on, but now is the time to prepare the car to go to MOT and other stuff are priority to do that.
Badmoon
Member +
As you say, there is power to be made by adjusting/trimming the fuel accordingly through the RPM range, but I'm going nowhere if I try to use the HKS PFC F-CON in this case I think. I only own the main unit with the E304 ROM, the 3bar MAP sensor and the FCD (which I never had the chance to install and use), so I'm missing the main accessories for the fuel fine tuning... The VPC and the GCC. If I owned these most probably would never have bought the preprogrammed ECU to manage my engine. And I must say from my experience that, I don't know if it's just me or anyone else had the same feeling when they were working properly, the HKS PFC F-CON was a blast throught the whole RPM range, I think the preprogrammed ECU is only better at higher RPMs, maybe because of the timing advance. But this was the main reason for me asking this question about the preprogrammed ECU + the HKS PFC F-CON in the first place... If I could use the preprogrammed ECU with all the restrictions it takes out and the better advanced timing in conjunction with the HKS PFC F-CON for better fueling as I feel it is better for it.
gorganl2000
Lifer
and that's the thing with preprogrammed ecus...based on research, they seem to be programmed for specific set ups, even within the same brand, so you never really know what the exact specifications are when you get one
on a side note, in my opinion, the preprogrammed ecus were a great addition may be 10/20 years ago when other options were very limited and expensive...but with a wide range of reliable piggybacks and standalones available nowadays that are tunable to match your specific set up requirements, the preprogrammed ecus are comparatively less efficient. However, they may have that prestige/classic/collector's effect for some people --- that's why they generally sell for more money that they may be worth. But to each their own.
That's solely and respectfully my opinion
on a side note, in my opinion, the preprogrammed ecus were a great addition may be 10/20 years ago when other options were very limited and expensive...but with a wide range of reliable piggybacks and standalones available nowadays that are tunable to match your specific set up requirements, the preprogrammed ecus are comparatively less efficient. However, they may have that prestige/classic/collector's effect for some people --- that's why they generally sell for more money that they may be worth. But to each their own.
That's solely and respectfully my opinion
Badmoon
Member +
At the time I got my preprogrammed ECU, which is a Blitz Access, I contacted Blitz and after giving them the ECU part number they gave me the details of the tune in my ECU. Stock EP82, CT9@1.1bar, no speed limit, fuel cut removed, RPM raised to 7500. They didn't have any information of other supporting mods, which I have all the basic ones, but also stated that it was mapped to be used with the catalytic converter, which I removed a long time... So basically my setup almost matches what the ECU was tuned for, can't say the ECU is bad or not I think it's doing its job and my engine seems happy to be playing with it. It's just as you say, its programmed like this and if I want a more specific tune I need to go to another kind of management. In the end of the day I'm happy with this ECU and its overall performance. Just love to ride my car and put many "high performance" cars or diesel coal machines to shame! Nothing pays for that joy, or better a 4efte does! Love this little engine!!and that's the thing with preprogrammed ecus...based on research, they seem to be programmed for specific set ups, even within the same brand, so you never really know what the exact specifications are when you get one
on a side note, in my opinion, the preprogrammed ecus were a great addition may be 10/20 years ago when other options were very limited and expensive...but with a wide range of reliable piggybacks and standalones available nowadays that are tunable to match your specific set up requirements, the preprogrammed ecus are comparatively less efficient. However, they may have that prestige/classic/collector's effect for some people --- that's why they generally sell for more money that they may be worth. But to each their own.
That's solely and respectfully my opinion
gibby1980
Member +
@gorganl2000 Before I switched to the MS3 or AEM EMS-4, I ran the 5EFTHE, GT2871r with the stock 295cc injectors with the JAM ecu to 13psi.
Once I started to go over 13psi, the mixtures started to lean out.(12's-13's) on the wideband. I probably could have tried turning the FPR up but I wasn't sure how far the Jam would lean out the mixtures at idle.
Once I started to go over 13psi, the mixtures started to lean out.(12's-13's) on the wideband. I probably could have tried turning the FPR up but I wasn't sure how far the Jam would lean out the mixtures at idle.