glanzanut
Lifer
it was a friendly enough debate till you came in with an aggressive post, need for swearing?
If you can't debate without losing ur cool why bother?
'Muhammad' ranked most popular boys' name in England
- Thread starter Gryzor
- Start date
If you can't debate without losing ur cool why bother?
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^^ the role of the scholors it help us understand the context of the verses and how the prophet and his companions understood them. From that we take the correct meanings. There will always be some people who get it wrong, but thats life.
As for being loosly interpretted, i would disagree. All the knowlege is ther for us, its just people havent taken the time to find it from the correct sources i.e. the example of the prophet - sunnah, which can be found in the authentic narrations call hadith.
hope that made sense
As for being loosly interpretted, i would disagree. All the knowlege is ther for us, its just people havent taken the time to find it from the correct sources i.e. the example of the prophet - sunnah, which can be found in the authentic narrations call hadith.
hope that made sense
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In reply to glanzanut since you asked for a reply
"10. A husband has sex with his wife, as a plow goes into a field.
The Quran in Sura (Chapter) 2:223 says:
Your women are your fields, so go into your fields whichever way you like . . . . (MAS Abdel Haleem, The Qur’an, Oxford UP, 2004)"
this is the what it says in the Quran on that verse.
Your wives are your tilth; so go to your tilth when you like. Take care of
your future and refrain from the displeasure of Allah. Bear in mind that you shall meet
Him in the Hereafter, and give good news to the believers.[2:223]
This is the translation i have, as you can see they are different. test the transalation using more than 1 source.
A husband has sex with his wife, as a plow goes into a field? what does that mean?
9. Husbands are a degree above their wives.
The Quran in Sura 2:228 says:
. . . Wives have the same rights as the husbands have on them in accordance with the generally known principles. Of course, men are a degree above them in status . . . (Sayyid Abul A’La Maududi, The Meaning of the Qur’an, vol. 1, p. 165)
Divorced women must keep themselves waiting for three menstrual periods, it is not
lawful for them to hide what Allah has created in their wombs, if they believe in Allah
and the Last Day. In such cases their husbands have a right to take them back in that
period if they desire reconciliation. Women have rights similar to those exercised
against them in an equitable manner, although men have a status (degree of
responsibility) above them. Allah is Mighty, Wise.[228] 2:[228]
again there is a lot of difference. to be honest the context of the Qur'an is completely different.
8. A male gets a double share of the inheritance over that of a female.
The Quran in Sura 4:11 says:
The share of the male shall be twice that of a female . . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 311)
My quran transaltion says
In regard to inheritance Allah commands you concerning your children: that the share
of a boy shall be twice that of a girl. In the case where there are more than two girls,
their share will be two thirds of the estate; but if there is only one girl, her share will
be one half of the estate. If the deceased left children behind, each of the parents
shall get one sixth of the estate, but if the deceased left no children and the parents
are the only heirs, the mother shall get one third of the estate, but if the deceased left
brothers and sisters, then the mother will get one sixth of it. The distribution in all
cases shall be after fulfilling the terms of the last will and the payment of debts. With
regards to your parents and your children, you do not know who is more beneficial to
you, therefore, Allah issued this ordinance. Surely Allah is the Knowledgeable,
Wise.
the son does get more of the inheritance of the male, but this is because he has more financial responsibilities within the household. the women or sister in this case will get married and have her husband looking after her leaving less
financial responsibilities.
7. A woman’s testimony counts half of a man’s testimony.
The Quran in Sura 2:282 says:
And let two men from among you bear witness to all such documents [contracts of loans without interest].
But if two men be not available, there should be one man and two women to bear witness so that if one of the women forgets (anything), the other may remind her. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 205).
6. A wife may remarry her ex—husband if and only if she marries another man and then this second man divorces her.
The Quran in Sura 2:230 says:
And if the husband divorces his wife (for the third time), she shall not remain his lawful wife after this (absolute) divorce, unless she marries another husband and the second husband divorces her. [In that case] there is no harm if they [the first couple] remarry . . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 165)
My translation:
So if a husband divorces his wife three times,
it is not lawful for him to remarry her until after she has married another man and
gotten the divorced. In that case there is no blame on either of them if they reunite in
marriage, provided they think that they can keep the limits of Allah. Such are the
limits of Allah which He makes clear to the people of understanding.
there is a limit on the number of times you can divorce your wife, you would think once of twice would be enough but God has set the limits to three times,
and this is what we follow. i dont understand whats to wrong with it, if you DIVORCE someone three times something is not right
these are the boudaries set by god which are prefectly reasonable.
5. Slave—girls are sexual property for their male owners.
The Quran in Sura 4:24 says:
And forbidden to you are wedded wives of other people except those who have fallen in your hands [as prisoners of war] . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 319).
Also forbidden for you are married women, except those who have fallen in your
hands as prisoners of war. This is the order of Allah relating to marriage prohibitions.
All women other than these are lawful provided you seek them in marriage with gifts
from your property (dowry), desiring chastity and not lust. Give them their dowry as
an obligation for the benefit you have received from your marriage relationship.
However, there is no blame on you if you change the agreement of dowry with
mutual consent. Allah is the Knowledgeable, Wise.[ 4:[24]
you can only marry them if they want to marry you, in islam the women has the choice to accept or neglect proposal. the women who you
have caputured must be muslim before you marry. this is in the case that they are capurted and convert to islam. dont know where slave girl
comes into it.
4. A man may be polygamous with up to four wives.
The Quran in Sura 4:3 says:
And if you be apprehensive that you will not be able to do justice to the orphans, you may marry two or three or four women whom you choose. But if you apprehend that you might not be able to do justice to them, then marry only one wife, or marry those who have fallen in your possession. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 305)
If you fear that you shall not be able to treat the orphans with fairness, then you
should not marry the women with orphan children; marry other women of your
choice: two, three or four. But if you fear that you will not be able to maintain justice
between your wives, then marry only one.4:[3]
science tell you today that females are out populating males.
here is quick a video ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuERO10ZMGofeature=related
watch the first 2-3 minutes it will briefly explain why.
3. A husband may simply get rid of one of his undesirable wives.
The Quran in Sura 4:129 says:
It is not within your power to be perfectly equitable in your treatment with all your wives, even if you wish to be so; therefore, [in order to satisfy the dictates of Divine Law] do not lean towards one wife so as to leave the other in a state of suspense. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 381)
It is not possible for you to do justice between your wives even if you
wish to do so; therefore, in order to comply with Divine Law, do not lean towards one
wife to the extent that you leave the other hanging in air. If you work out a friendly
understanding and fear Allah, Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.[4:129]
this is if you are married with two wife's and you cannot fulfill fairness between both of them work out an agreement so both wife's
know were they stand. Nothing is said about disposing of one wife.
2. Husbands may hit their wives even if the husbands merely fear highhandedness in their wives (quite apart from whether they actually are highhanded).
The Quran in Sura 4:34 says:
4:34 . . . If you fear highhandedness from your wives, remind them [of the teaching of God], then ignore them when you go to bed, then hit them. If they obey you, you have no right to act against them. God is most high and great. (Haleem, emphasis added)
Men are overseers over women because Allah has given the one more strength than
the other, and because men are required to spend their wealth for the maintenance
of women. Honorable women are, therefore, devoutly obedient and guard in the
husband’s absence what Allah requires them to guard their husband’s property and
their own honor. As to those women from whom you fear disobedience, first
admonish them, then refuse to share your bed with them, and then, if necessary,
beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further actions against them and do not
make excuses to punish them. Allah is Supremely Great and is aware of your
actions.
this is a series of event, if the wife does something wrong first you don't talk to her, if she she carries on and keeps doing her wrong doing then don't
share your bed with her and the key is the verse is "if necessary beat them", we never hit our wife hard or on the face. we are not allowed to hit animals on the face so how do believe we hit them?? NO we dont do what you think we do. most cases this never will take place because arguing leads to divorces/separation.
1. Mature men are allowed to marry prepubescent girls.
The Quran in Sura 65:1, 4 says:
65:1 O Prophet, when you [and the believers] divorce women, divorce them for their prescribed waiting—period and count the waiting—period accurately . . . 4 And if you are in doubt about those of your women who have despaired of menstruation, (you should know that) their waiting period is three months, and the same applies to those who have not menstruated as yet. As for pregnant women, their period ends when they have delivered their burden. (Maududi, vol. 5, pp. 599 and 617, emphasis added)
O Prophet! If you and the believers divorce your wives, divorce them at the end of
their prescribed periods, and count their prescribed periods accurately. Fear Allah, Your Lord
Do not expel them from their homes during their waiting period, nor they
themselves should leave, unless they have committed an open lewdness. These are
limits set by Allah; he that transgresses the limits of Allah will wrong his own soul.
You never know, Allah may, thereafter, bring about some new situation of
reconciliation.
have you read this? its got nothing to do with prepubescent girls. it talks about divorce and the period in which you can take your wife back if you reconsider.
""and i could post countless hate sections from the quran, talking about killing people of other religions and beliefs.
yes the n.h.s is supported greatly by a large number of muslims, did anyone say muslims werent intelligent?
so your saying there isnt thosands of muslims who claim benifits and dont contribute to society? pull the other one!
i'd like you to explane those articles i put up please""
please post them up because i will try my best to answer them as i have answered your other questions and thoughts. did you find these in the Qur 'an yourself?
since your not using any christian texts or other religion i would make a assumption that your atheist. if im wrong correct me,
here is a link to a video, watch it and tell me what you think. bit lengthy though but i hope it will get you thinking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fn5gXHINbNc
long reply i know if there are spelling mistake and badly presented i apologies.
"10. A husband has sex with his wife, as a plow goes into a field.
The Quran in Sura (Chapter) 2:223 says:
Your women are your fields, so go into your fields whichever way you like . . . . (MAS Abdel Haleem, The Qur’an, Oxford UP, 2004)"
this is the what it says in the Quran on that verse.
Your wives are your tilth; so go to your tilth when you like. Take care of
your future and refrain from the displeasure of Allah. Bear in mind that you shall meet
Him in the Hereafter, and give good news to the believers.[2:223]
This is the translation i have, as you can see they are different. test the transalation using more than 1 source.
A husband has sex with his wife, as a plow goes into a field? what does that mean?
9. Husbands are a degree above their wives.
The Quran in Sura 2:228 says:
. . . Wives have the same rights as the husbands have on them in accordance with the generally known principles. Of course, men are a degree above them in status . . . (Sayyid Abul A’La Maududi, The Meaning of the Qur’an, vol. 1, p. 165)
Divorced women must keep themselves waiting for three menstrual periods, it is not
lawful for them to hide what Allah has created in their wombs, if they believe in Allah
and the Last Day. In such cases their husbands have a right to take them back in that
period if they desire reconciliation. Women have rights similar to those exercised
against them in an equitable manner, although men have a status (degree of
responsibility) above them. Allah is Mighty, Wise.[228] 2:[228]
again there is a lot of difference. to be honest the context of the Qur'an is completely different.
8. A male gets a double share of the inheritance over that of a female.
The Quran in Sura 4:11 says:
The share of the male shall be twice that of a female . . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 311)
My quran transaltion says
In regard to inheritance Allah commands you concerning your children: that the share
of a boy shall be twice that of a girl. In the case where there are more than two girls,
their share will be two thirds of the estate; but if there is only one girl, her share will
be one half of the estate. If the deceased left children behind, each of the parents
shall get one sixth of the estate, but if the deceased left no children and the parents
are the only heirs, the mother shall get one third of the estate, but if the deceased left
brothers and sisters, then the mother will get one sixth of it. The distribution in all
cases shall be after fulfilling the terms of the last will and the payment of debts. With
regards to your parents and your children, you do not know who is more beneficial to
you, therefore, Allah issued this ordinance. Surely Allah is the Knowledgeable,
Wise.
the son does get more of the inheritance of the male, but this is because he has more financial responsibilities within the household. the women or sister in this case will get married and have her husband looking after her leaving less
financial responsibilities.
7. A woman’s testimony counts half of a man’s testimony.
The Quran in Sura 2:282 says:
And let two men from among you bear witness to all such documents [contracts of loans without interest].
But if two men be not available, there should be one man and two women to bear witness so that if one of the women forgets (anything), the other may remind her. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 205).
6. A wife may remarry her ex—husband if and only if she marries another man and then this second man divorces her.
The Quran in Sura 2:230 says:
And if the husband divorces his wife (for the third time), she shall not remain his lawful wife after this (absolute) divorce, unless she marries another husband and the second husband divorces her. [In that case] there is no harm if they [the first couple] remarry . . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 165)
My translation:
So if a husband divorces his wife three times,
it is not lawful for him to remarry her until after she has married another man and
gotten the divorced. In that case there is no blame on either of them if they reunite in
marriage, provided they think that they can keep the limits of Allah. Such are the
limits of Allah which He makes clear to the people of understanding.
there is a limit on the number of times you can divorce your wife, you would think once of twice would be enough but God has set the limits to three times,
and this is what we follow. i dont understand whats to wrong with it, if you DIVORCE someone three times something is not right
these are the boudaries set by god which are prefectly reasonable.
5. Slave—girls are sexual property for their male owners.
The Quran in Sura 4:24 says:
And forbidden to you are wedded wives of other people except those who have fallen in your hands [as prisoners of war] . . . (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 319).
Also forbidden for you are married women, except those who have fallen in your
hands as prisoners of war. This is the order of Allah relating to marriage prohibitions.
All women other than these are lawful provided you seek them in marriage with gifts
from your property (dowry), desiring chastity and not lust. Give them their dowry as
an obligation for the benefit you have received from your marriage relationship.
However, there is no blame on you if you change the agreement of dowry with
mutual consent. Allah is the Knowledgeable, Wise.[ 4:[24]
you can only marry them if they want to marry you, in islam the women has the choice to accept or neglect proposal. the women who you
have caputured must be muslim before you marry. this is in the case that they are capurted and convert to islam. dont know where slave girl
comes into it.
4. A man may be polygamous with up to four wives.
The Quran in Sura 4:3 says:
And if you be apprehensive that you will not be able to do justice to the orphans, you may marry two or three or four women whom you choose. But if you apprehend that you might not be able to do justice to them, then marry only one wife, or marry those who have fallen in your possession. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 305)
If you fear that you shall not be able to treat the orphans with fairness, then you
should not marry the women with orphan children; marry other women of your
choice: two, three or four. But if you fear that you will not be able to maintain justice
between your wives, then marry only one.4:[3]
science tell you today that females are out populating males.
here is quick a video ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuERO10ZMGofeature=related
watch the first 2-3 minutes it will briefly explain why.
3. A husband may simply get rid of one of his undesirable wives.
The Quran in Sura 4:129 says:
It is not within your power to be perfectly equitable in your treatment with all your wives, even if you wish to be so; therefore, [in order to satisfy the dictates of Divine Law] do not lean towards one wife so as to leave the other in a state of suspense. (Maududi, vol. 1, p. 381)
It is not possible for you to do justice between your wives even if you
wish to do so; therefore, in order to comply with Divine Law, do not lean towards one
wife to the extent that you leave the other hanging in air. If you work out a friendly
understanding and fear Allah, Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.[4:129]
this is if you are married with two wife's and you cannot fulfill fairness between both of them work out an agreement so both wife's
know were they stand. Nothing is said about disposing of one wife.
2. Husbands may hit their wives even if the husbands merely fear highhandedness in their wives (quite apart from whether they actually are highhanded).
The Quran in Sura 4:34 says:
4:34 . . . If you fear highhandedness from your wives, remind them [of the teaching of God], then ignore them when you go to bed, then hit them. If they obey you, you have no right to act against them. God is most high and great. (Haleem, emphasis added)
Men are overseers over women because Allah has given the one more strength than
the other, and because men are required to spend their wealth for the maintenance
of women. Honorable women are, therefore, devoutly obedient and guard in the
husband’s absence what Allah requires them to guard their husband’s property and
their own honor. As to those women from whom you fear disobedience, first
admonish them, then refuse to share your bed with them, and then, if necessary,
beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further actions against them and do not
make excuses to punish them. Allah is Supremely Great and is aware of your
actions.
this is a series of event, if the wife does something wrong first you don't talk to her, if she she carries on and keeps doing her wrong doing then don't
share your bed with her and the key is the verse is "if necessary beat them", we never hit our wife hard or on the face. we are not allowed to hit animals on the face so how do believe we hit them?? NO we dont do what you think we do. most cases this never will take place because arguing leads to divorces/separation.
1. Mature men are allowed to marry prepubescent girls.
The Quran in Sura 65:1, 4 says:
65:1 O Prophet, when you [and the believers] divorce women, divorce them for their prescribed waiting—period and count the waiting—period accurately . . . 4 And if you are in doubt about those of your women who have despaired of menstruation, (you should know that) their waiting period is three months, and the same applies to those who have not menstruated as yet. As for pregnant women, their period ends when they have delivered their burden. (Maududi, vol. 5, pp. 599 and 617, emphasis added)
O Prophet! If you and the believers divorce your wives, divorce them at the end of
their prescribed periods, and count their prescribed periods accurately. Fear Allah, Your Lord
Do not expel them from their homes during their waiting period, nor they
themselves should leave, unless they have committed an open lewdness. These are
limits set by Allah; he that transgresses the limits of Allah will wrong his own soul.
You never know, Allah may, thereafter, bring about some new situation of
reconciliation.
have you read this? its got nothing to do with prepubescent girls. it talks about divorce and the period in which you can take your wife back if you reconsider.
""and i could post countless hate sections from the quran, talking about killing people of other religions and beliefs.
yes the n.h.s is supported greatly by a large number of muslims, did anyone say muslims werent intelligent?
so your saying there isnt thosands of muslims who claim benifits and dont contribute to society? pull the other one!
i'd like you to explane those articles i put up please""
please post them up because i will try my best to answer them as i have answered your other questions and thoughts. did you find these in the Qur 'an yourself?
since your not using any christian texts or other religion i would make a assumption that your atheist. if im wrong correct me,
here is a link to a video, watch it and tell me what you think. bit lengthy though but i hope it will get you thinking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fn5gXHINbNc
long reply i know if there are spelling mistake and badly presented i apologies.
Last edited: