burning of the quran- thoughts?

[pig666eon]

Firstly sorry that wasn't aimed directly at you, just meant it in general but I guess I used 'you' in an open haste.

We are trying to distinguish, tell apart every day Muslims to extremists. All you've got to do is know a few Muslims to know this, or even have things like Facebook to see we DON'T advocate or support extreme Muslims groups.

I am part of this group in conjunction with many other modern Muslims who are not poisoned. It's a facebook group called 'MUSLIMS ARE NOT TERRORISTS AND TERRORISTS ARE NOT MUSLIMS'

This group was created by a 17 year old Muslim, like me, and you (as a non-Muslim) angry with terrorism.

'As a 17 year old and a British born Muslim, i find it a disgrace what these so-called "muslims" are doing. They carry out these terrorist attacks and actions claiming to be doing these in the name of Allah (islamic name for god). This is utter nonsense. This is creating a lot of predjudice against the real Muslims and our country, England is slowly becoming more anti-islamic due to these so-called "muslims." REAL muslims dont want war, REAL muslims love this country and REAL muslims are NOT terrorists!'

That's quoted off the Facebook homepage just in case you don't have facebook.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=235659238940&v=info&ref=ts

So things are being done, and only within time I'm sure different colour shirts will be worn just to point out to non-Muslims whom terrorists are and aren't - wouldn't that be dandy.

like you said i agree with all the people who try to stop this, that terrorism is not the way forward and should be stopped. my point was that as a global religion it needs to be stopped from the inside. i dont want to make any more points on protests this will be my last but a majority of the uk muslim community were out in 2006 over what went on and did cause people alot of hassle. which is not they way forward. people cant say terrorism is bad and then go out and do this. it in itself is a act of terrorism. i dont like it anymore than you do but but the general community has to be able to say no before they are branded as the same. they really need to do more. i know what your saying that they shouldnt have to but its just the way it is.

 

[bridgo]

Allah AkBOOM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNuHdNRfgzo

 

[addz]

like you said i agree with all the people who try to stop this, that terrorism is not the way forward and should be stopped. my point was that as a global religion it needs to be stopped from the inside. i dont want to make any more points on protests this will be my last but a majority of the uk muslim community were out in 2006 over what went on and did cause people alot of hassle. which is not they way forward. people cant say terrorism is bad and then go out and do this. it in itself is a act of terrorism. i dont like it anymore than you do but but the general community has to be able to say no before they are branded as the same. they really need to do more. i know what your saying that they shouldnt have to but its just the way it is.

Unfortunately you must be dreaming with high hopes of utopia. Life isn't so easy to 'stop' things because one doesn't like. Like many things such as cancer, can find solutions to cure, sometimes long-term, other times, temporarily.

I hope for the sake of you they stop it because 'you' don't like it. Like many things I don't like, I just hope they stop it. And with many things I adore such as 'cadburys whisper bar' - hope they carry that on too.

 

[pig666eon]

Unfortunately you must be dreaming with high hopes of utopia. Life isn't so easy to 'stop' things because one doesn't like. Like many things such as cancer, can find solutions to cure, sometimes long-term, other times, temporarily.

I hope for the sake of you they stop it because 'you' don't like it. Like many things I don't like, I just hope they stop it. And with many things I adore such as 'cadburys whisper bar' - hope they carry that on too.

whats wrong with hopes of utopia? .no its not easy but life isnt easy and all of the bullshit doesnt make it any easyer. nobody asked for it so why force it

go fuck yourself with your last comment man. simple as you knew what i ment

 

[addz]

whats wrong with hopes of utopia? .no its not easy but life isnt easy and all of the bullshit doesnt make it any easyer. nobody asked for it so why force it

go fuck yourself with your last comment man. simple as you knew what i ment

Utopia is good, but in this case I think we need reality, and then utopia.

Thanks for the advice but I think you might realise, that isn't possible. Threads like this get nowhere, that's why I usually don't contribute but watch over like a ghost.

 

[pig666eon]

Utopia is good, but in this case I think we need reality, and then utopia.

Thanks for the advice but I think you might realise, that isn't possible. Threads like this get nowhere, that's why I usually don't contribute but watch over like a ghost.

well i wasnt expecting this thread to bring peace to the world man that is just silly thinking. im glad you did man because people can see your one level of taught. you are not going to win over any people here by making snide remarks.

if i said fuck off would you say whos off? you sound like a child

 

[williamocarroll1982]

I can't answer all of your questions as I am not in the power or position nor immense knowledge to do so, but of which I can, I will. To kill in the name of Allah for frenzy is forbidden, and only hell is destined. Also the Qur'an is a book of life, a way of living. If people are killed or hurt for plain disobedience then only hell is destined for one. Islam is a very stern religion, and for one to be devout one cannot harm another, and must follow in a strict manor possible (humble and sincere). Once, let's in laymens terminology, 'terms and condition' have been breached in Islam according to the Qur'an, you become astray and only utter repentance and years of supplication MAY make up for wrongdoings. Islam is a very forgiving religion, but once gone astray from the correct path, only mankind can consider forgiving. Christianity and Islam does share some similar values. There is only ONE version of the Qur'an, never has there been a revised model opposed to the Bible - it is very authentic, and only genuine Muslims can call themselves Muslims. We are all sinners, but once a serious act has been committed, only the court of the almighty can forgive. Similar to committing an offence such as murder, in the court of law serious supplication can be exchanged, but when the jury makes it's mind, your going down. Yes we're all sinners like the example I've given, but some sins just can't be cleared with ease. Just like Starlet sinners whom ruin/chav/destroy their cars, they get lambasted and rebuked - but will you forgive

First of all the Qur'an isn't anymore authentic than the Bible just because it it has never been revised, if anything its less progressive. The only way we can improve our limited understanding of God is to constantly look at how we interpret his word and teachings. Standing still never got the human race anywhere, think of the dark ages!! I have nothing against Islam or the Qur'an, infact, my curiosity compels me to learn as much as I can about anything i encounter. I'd love to and eventually will sit down and read the Qur'an to the best of my ability. I believe in the same God as you do and think it is only right to see how another creed view that same God

Secondly, you keep saying that if somebody acts against the teaching of Islam then they are not a Muslim, That is too simplistic of a view to take and it free's all Muslims of their guilt and of there responsibilities as a religion. By that way of thinking, in WWII, the German people we innocent of the Holocaust because they didn't lock the Jews in concentration camps, Hitler did. The German people were just as guilty as Hitler was because they allowed this to happen. The vast majority of Muslims in western countries (like yourself) are not the people i am talking about, I am talking about the ordinary descent Muslim in the middle east who know whats going on, know the people who are involved and choose to do nothing

You cant have it both ways, you cant deny these people are "true" members of your faith and then stand by and let them commit these terrible crimes. To me, these people are terrorists too

 

[addz]

First of all the Qur'an isn't anymore authentic than the Bible just because it it has never been revised, if anything its less progressive. The only way we can improve our limited understanding of God is to constantly look at how we interpret his word and teachings. Standing still never got the human race anywhere, think of the dark ages!! I have nothing against Islam or the Qur'an, infact, my curiosity compels me to learn as much as I can about anything i encounter. I'd love to and eventually will sit down and read the Qur'an to the best of my ability. I believe in the same God as you do and think it is only right to see how another creed view that same God

Secondly, you keep saying that if somebody acts against the teaching of Islam then they are not a Muslim, That is too simplistic of a view to take and it free's all Muslims of their guilt and of there responsibilities as a religion. By that way of thinking, in WWII, the German people we innocent of the Holocaust because they didn't lock the Jews in concentration camps, Hitler did. The German people were just as guilty as Hitler was because they allowed this to happen. The vast majority of Muslims in western countries (like yourself) are not the people i am talking about, I am talking about the ordinary descent Muslim in the middle east who know whats going on, know the people who are involved and choose to do nothing

You cant have it both ways, you cant deny these people are "true" members of your faith and then stand by and let them commit these terrible crimes. To me, these people are terrorists too

It is all in the Qur'an, and you can also get English translations, be none wiser to read it if you want to understand where I am coming from. And this isn't like a un-modern car where it ages and gets left behind, the Qur'an is still ahead to this day. Also what doctors and scientists reveal today, it was covered back when the Qur'an was established. These guys are going by the names of 'Muslims' and committing acts which a 'Muslim' wouldn't do, and it states in the Qur'an, they are non believers and have gone astray.

In fact I have no more time on this thread as input just doesn't register. It's been nice sharing information and views. Big respect to Wesgt for understanding from the start that burning of any religious book is worng, full stop - a sincere man right there.

 

[pig666eon]

First of all the Qur'an isn't anymore authentic than the Bible just because it it has never been revised, if anything its less progressive. The only way we can improve our limited understanding of God is to constantly look at how we interpret his word and teachings. Standing still never got the human race anywhere, think of the dark ages!! I have nothing against Islam or the Qur'an, infact, my curiosity compels me to learn as much as I can about anything i encounter. I'd love to and eventually will sit down and read the Qur'an to the best of my ability. I believe in the same God as you do and think it is only right to see how another creed view that same God

Secondly, you keep saying that if somebody acts against the teaching of Islam then they are not a Muslim, That is too simplistic of a view to take and it free's all Muslims of their guilt and of there responsibilities as a religion. By that way of thinking, in WWII, the German people we innocent of the Holocaust because they didn't lock the Jews in concentration camps, Hitler did. The German people were just as guilty as Hitler was because they allowed this to happen. The vast majority of Muslims in western countries (like yourself) are not the people i am talking about, I am talking about the ordinary descent Muslim in the middle east who know whats going on, know the people who are involved and choose to do nothing

You cant have it both ways, you cant deny these people are "true" members of your faith and then stand by and let them commit these terrible crimes. To me, these people are terrorists too

at least there is people out there that get it good man. lets start a thread about not burning flags and the importance people hold for them. again utterly pointless but muslims cant give out about book burnings while they are burning flags

 

[GTnomez]

LOL @ the Satanic flying rat

 

[Sheldon]

do muslims make mistakes? or no? just cos they are muslims... ?

 

[GTnomez]

You sound VERY stupid Sheldon.

 

[williamocarroll1982]

It is all in the Qur'an, and you can also get English translations, be none wiser to read it if you want to understand where I am coming from. And this isn't like a un-modern car where it ages and gets left behind, the Qur'an is still ahead to this day. Also what doctors and scientists reveal today, it was covered back when the Qur'an was established. These guys are going by the names of 'Muslims' and committing acts which a 'Muslim' wouldn't do, and it states in the Qur'an, they are non believers and have gone astray.

In fact I have no more time on this thread as input just doesn't register. It's been nice sharing information and views. Big respect to Wesgt for understanding from the start that burning of any religious book is worng, full stop - a sincere man right there.

Thats fair enough, I understand you may be getting sick of it but don't think that I don't understand or respect your point of view. I don't condone what that preacher did, I just said he was just as entitled to burn the Qur'an just as much as others are entitled to burn a flag. They are burning the flag for the very same reason that he was burning the Que'an, as a protest. Just because some believe that burning the Qur'an is far worse than burning a flag doesn't mean that others feel the same.

I believe in the same God that you do, I just pray to him differently. That, in my opinion is the only difference between me and you. Like I told you, I will read the Qur'an at some point and hopefully it will give me a better insight and understanding into how you formed your opinion. I have the utmost respect for you and ALL of your beliefs, don't for a second think anything different. Religion of ALL kinds, and those that practice it, is something that that is of great interest to me. I hope that my view on the subject has broadened your view on the subject just like your's has broadened mine

Regards
William

 

[Arnold]

A very interesting thread which i've read the majority of from start to finish. Not sure what I can contribute towards after so many posts. I generally think there's a lot of brainwashing out there, and religion is the key way of doing this to people. Take away the books, the churches and maybe peace on earth would start to become a real possibility, but it's unlikely. If people aren't prepared to open there eyes and live in the real world, where peace on earth surely is the best thing instead of all this blow yourself up and shag 6 virgins in heaven rubbish, then things will only continue to get worse.

 

[addz]

Thats fair enough, I understand you may be getting sick of it but don't think that I don't understand or respect your point of view. I don't condone what that preacher did, I just said he was just as entitled to burn the Qur'an just as much as others are entitled to burn a flag. They are burning the flag for the very same reason that he was burning the Que'an, as a protest. Just because some believe that burning the Qur'an is far worse than burning a flag doesn't mean that others feel the same.

I believe in the same God that you do, I just pray to him differently. That, in my opinion is the only difference between me and you. Like I told you, I will read the Qur'an at some point and hopefully it will give me a better insight and understanding into how you formed your opinion. I have the utmost respect for you and ALL of your beliefs, don't for a second think anything different. Religion of ALL kinds, and those that practice it, is something that that is of great interest to me. I hope that my view on the subject has broadened your view on the subject just like your's has broadened mine

Regards
William

I respect what you're saying William, and I also respect other religions I don't follow, whether it's regarding God, Allah, Jehovah or the likes.

A very interesting thread which i've read the majority of from start to finish. Not sure what I can contribute towards after so many posts. I generally think there's a lot of brainwashing out there, and religion is the key way of doing this to people. Take away the books, the churches and maybe peace on earth would start to become a real possibility, but it's unlikely. If people aren't prepared to open there eyes and live in the real world, where peace on earth surely is the best thing instead of all this blow yourself up and shag 6 virgins in heaven rubbish, then things will only continue to get worse.

Also, Arnold, where do you get those figures from, the single digit second to last line? Try putting some study or research into your numbers and reasons before you start posting rubbish. Another iconclast muttering what he's heard outside without a doubt.

 

[Arnold]

Also, Arnold, where do you get those figures from, the single digit second to last line? Try putting some study or research into your numbers and reasons before you start posting rubbish. Another iconclast muttering what he's heard outside without a doubt.

Possibly so, I cannot recall where I heard such a statement but I know it's been told to me various times. Doesn't matter if it's from religious text, the media or from my mates, opinions/thoughts on subjects are made up of what we hear as well as what we read. I didn't realise i had to be 100% accurate with my statement to have an opinion on here.

 

[addz]

Possibly so, I cannot recall where I heard such a statement but I know it's been told to me various times. Doesn't matter if it's from religious text, the media or from my mates, opinions/thoughts on subjects are made up of what we hear as well as what we read. I didn't realise i had to be 100% accurate with my statement to have an opinion on here.

No, certainly you didn't need 'accurate' information to a religion you don't follow, but it can be very misleading in your case which it has been. Sometimes hearing isn't believing, and seeing isn't either, but education is the most important.

Just think of it as surmising a Starlets HP and passing that information on, which is not accurate one chance.

 

[Sheldon]

You sound VERY stupid Sheldon.

what about you with a reply like that?


when someone is saying muslims do this and muslims do that.. all im seing here is "no does people are not muslims cos muslims didnt learn to do these things"

 

[williamocarroll1982]

A very interesting thread which i've read the majority of from start to finish. Not sure what I can contribute towards after so many posts. I generally think there's a lot of brainwashing out there, and religion is the key way of doing this to people. Take away the books, the churches and maybe peace on earth would start to become a real possibility, but it's unlikely. If people aren't prepared to open there eyes and live in the real world, where peace on earth surely is the best thing instead of all this blow yourself up and shag 6 virgins in heaven rubbish, then things will only continue to get worse.

To clarify, the concept is to receive 72 virgins, not 6

 

[corofin12345]

im goin to be shot...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uwOL4rB-go