AzE_B
Member +
ditto really
speedvision valve springs
- Thread starter Dan-The-Glanza-Man
- Start date
ditto really
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
yeah were the heads come off the valves its dented the bores and the top so needs a new block i brought the 5e lump for 250 having the oil housing trapped and threaded cost 65 quid and reboring and skimming the block cost 250 quid so thats alredi 565, then pistons and rods maybe could be bent metal may have got in the bottom end more money ect balancing..... 
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
if you look at the second picture they must be so high pressured its like they pushed there way out bit by bit eating the spring holders bit by bit then finnally let go causing the valve to drop if any one gets me and the extra lift of the cams as gaz just said proberly didnt help but you would have thought being made buy same company would both work better togerther
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
well gotta see what happens weather it does get sorrted ect or i break what i can and put a standard engine back in and sell it but i really do love the car to bits the time and money ive spent on it im proud of it but not now lol
aze its 5e all the way and not a td04 lol ihi vf35
aze its 5e all the way and not a td04 lol ihi vf35
Texx
Super Moderator
http://www.toyotagtturbo.com/forums/showthread.php?p=773531#post773531
Just out of interest, who did you complain to about the noise and who informed you that it's normal for uprated valve springs to be noisy?
Just out of interest, who did you complain to about the noise and who informed you that it's normal for uprated valve springs to be noisy?
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
told nick about it and he said was normal for speedvision valve springs amd forged engines are noisey them self i understand...... but this is somthing thats just let go as if to much pressure and fucked my whole engine now i havent the money to do it all again i also have a baby on the way not good
thats fuckud up badly.
i was going to use these springs also, but my engine builder building standards didn't meet them.
"they are good for stock spring (pre)tension, above that they will smash solid."
that is what my builder told me.
that is why the machined it to fit hayabussa springs.
i was going to use these springs also, but my engine builder building standards didn't meet them.
"they are good for stock spring (pre)tension, above that they will smash solid."
that is what my builder told me.
that is why the machined it to fit hayabussa springs.
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
why are they being sold if so much work needs doing to them and if the engine builder cant fit them they should say......
correct me if i understood you wrong.
my engine builder was fitting them(on there standards, higher (pre)tension) and they found out the smashed solid and could not get the stock lift(or just).
so the dropped there standard and they worked well on that, no head work needed(as far as i know), but they would not like to drop there standard so they didnt fit them and reworked the head to fit hayabussa springs(much more work but better lift and spring tension).
sx_turbo
Lifer
i'm pretty certain i said at the time that they shouldnt sound any louder,
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
i was also told they shoudent aswel ricky dude as springs are springs just coz there higher pressure dont make them sound louder i dont know weather it has somthing to do with when it was shimmed up and set up
Texx
Super Moderator
Any excessive valve train noise would indicate that something isn't right. Sometimes the cause can be difficult to diagnose and it's also possible it may not be causing much harm, but it should never be left unchecked. If every valve train component is specified, installed and set correctly regardless of any 'upgrades', then the valve train should not produce any more noise than a stock set up.
IMO excessive valve spring base pressure would more likely result in premature wear than physically break anything, so although I wouldn't rule it out as the cause of your failure, I wouldn't immediately put the blame there. I would be more interested to know the coil bind and installed height (to identify the maximum available travel) of the springs you are using and also the maximum lift of the camshafts.
Due to the design of the cylinder head it's difficult to check the installed height of the valve springs especially with limited equipment in a DIY environment, but you may be able to check them using the depth gauge of a digital vernier caliper (if it's thin enough to drop into the pocket past the spring), just be sure to subtract the thickness of the spring retainer from your measurements.
The coil bind height can be a little easier to measure, but you'll need the springs removed from the cylinder head. The easiest way to do this is to use a good sized bolt that will pass through the center of the spring, a couple of large thick washers (larger than the diameter of the spring) and a nut to tighten it all together. Fit one of the washers against the bolt head, pass the spring over the bolt up against the washer, fit the remaining washer over the bolt up against the spring, lubricate everything with some engine oil and then tighten the nut up until the coils of the spring close together (wear some safety goggles and do this with the spring vertical, not horizontal). Then measure the length of the valve spring again using a digital vernier caliper.
Then subtract the coil bind height measurement from the installed height measurement to identify the maximum available travel of the spring when installed.
Then measure the cam lobe between the peak of the nose and back of the lobe and then measure the cam lobe again at a 180° position. Now subtract the smaller measurement from the larger and you'll have a maximum lift measurement.
Now subtract the cams maximum lift measurement from the springs maximum available travel measurement and see what your left with. If it's less than 1.6mm (allowing for some measurement inaccuracy) then you likely have a problem that needs to be addressed.
Note: The above procedure and use of a vernier caliper, digital or not, is far from the most accurate of measuring methods to use, but as I said if your attempting this with limited equipment in a DIY environment it's probably the best your likely to have to hand and certainly better than building the cylinder head up 'unchecked'.
IMO excessive valve spring base pressure would more likely result in premature wear than physically break anything, so although I wouldn't rule it out as the cause of your failure, I wouldn't immediately put the blame there. I would be more interested to know the coil bind and installed height (to identify the maximum available travel) of the springs you are using and also the maximum lift of the camshafts.
Due to the design of the cylinder head it's difficult to check the installed height of the valve springs especially with limited equipment in a DIY environment, but you may be able to check them using the depth gauge of a digital vernier caliper (if it's thin enough to drop into the pocket past the spring), just be sure to subtract the thickness of the spring retainer from your measurements.
The coil bind height can be a little easier to measure, but you'll need the springs removed from the cylinder head. The easiest way to do this is to use a good sized bolt that will pass through the center of the spring, a couple of large thick washers (larger than the diameter of the spring) and a nut to tighten it all together. Fit one of the washers against the bolt head, pass the spring over the bolt up against the washer, fit the remaining washer over the bolt up against the spring, lubricate everything with some engine oil and then tighten the nut up until the coils of the spring close together (wear some safety goggles and do this with the spring vertical, not horizontal). Then measure the length of the valve spring again using a digital vernier caliper.
Then subtract the coil bind height measurement from the installed height measurement to identify the maximum available travel of the spring when installed.
Then measure the cam lobe between the peak of the nose and back of the lobe and then measure the cam lobe again at a 180° position. Now subtract the smaller measurement from the larger and you'll have a maximum lift measurement.
Now subtract the cams maximum lift measurement from the springs maximum available travel measurement and see what your left with. If it's less than 1.6mm (allowing for some measurement inaccuracy) then you likely have a problem that needs to be addressed.
Note: The above procedure and use of a vernier caliper, digital or not, is far from the most accurate of measuring methods to use, but as I said if your attempting this with limited equipment in a DIY environment it's probably the best your likely to have to hand and certainly better than building the cylinder head up 'unchecked'.
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
very truthful just hope its gets sorted i didnt do none of the head work as i didnt trust myself at the time.............
just hope its gets sorted i didnt do none of the head work as i didnt trust myself at the time.............
sx_turbo
Lifer
very truthful
what has nick and speedvision said?
do you want the phone number of an independent specialist to write you a report (he hasnt lost a court case yet)
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
i number would be good ricky matey well sams said check with your engine builder wearther he checked spring pressure base and im waiting for a reply from nick about that but he said he double checks every thing on it so must be part fault, the head is at a engine engineer place that build forge engines all day long so there going to right me a report on it ive told them what i thinks rong hopfully hear back from them today thanks for helping guys
thanks for helping guysDan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
who is to blame you can see that the springs were way to much pressure as you can see its not the only spring cap thats damaged 5 of them were about to compeltly snap and let the valves drop what do you guys think ?? shouldent be so high pressured if they are breaking the caps and letting go
sx_turbo
Lifer
well imo it's 70% of one and 30% of the other.
initially it would be nicks fault as he built the head and he shouldnt have assumed the springs would be direct fit.
but
speedvision was initially selling these as direct fit springs, and only recently (since someone complained) has he mentioned the fact that further machining may be needed.
initially it would be nicks fault as he built the head and he shouldnt have assumed the springs would be direct fit.
but
speedvision was initially selling these as direct fit springs, and only recently (since someone complained) has he mentioned the fact that further machining may be needed.
Dan-The-Glanza-Man
Member +
even if direct fit as an engine builder should be checking the pressure of them to make sure there not over pressured as its well known now for these springs to bea pain and has been known the amount of threads up for a while now it was done 7months ago and been running for 5 months..... just thinking if was somones fault would i still have to rebuild and pay for it i dont mind the rebuild maybe but the money i just cant sit around and spend another 8 months of my wages sitting in each night spending on bits and bobs for another 5e