SAFC removes fuel cut

ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
I've signed up to the Aus Starlet club and on a couple of occassions I have read posts saying that a SAFC can and does remove fuel cut, so you do not need a FCD to accompany it. Why would they be able to do that and we not? Has any one actually tried just a SAFC & FPR and got it tuned?

Worth a discussion I think!

Some links:

http://www.austarletclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=9547&st=60&p=136444&#entry136444

http://www.austarletclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=9547&st=60&p=136444&#entry136444 * So if fuel cut can only be raised if you are using the SAFC to "pull fuel out" i.e. lean it out, that would be perfect for a FPR/SAFC combination. Setting the FPR high, then using the SAFC to trim.

http://www.austarletclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=9547&view=findpost&p=136460
 
M

MWP

Member +
Do you know how a FCD and SAFC work?
I mean the theory behind them?

If you do, then you know a FCD isnt required as well as the SAFC will keep the map voltage below fuel cut if tuned properly.
 
M

Mart

Member +
I know this sounds strange mate but Im running a Safc and Fpr with no FCD. My mech set it all up. Mines set to .8 bar at the moment and if really pushed it often spikes up to over a Bar. Don't know if it makes a difference but mine is a N/A with Ep82 conversion.

I'll see if i can ring him to find out more... :confused:
 
Jay

Jay

Admin
In essence they are both fooling the ecu to think it is running less boost. A crude way of doing it but effective nonetheless.
 
Chris@CCM

Chris@CCM

Member +
yup as jay says a safc2 just lets u ajust the map reading the ecu sees at rpm ponts so if ur set it to show the ecu to show a lower map reading then the map sensor is giving it can remove fuel cut .
 
ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
Was just wondering as a lot of people run a FCD and SAFC together, but there is really no need then? And you could use a FPR and SAFC together without a FCD, use the SAFC to trim thereby raising fuel cut and get a good tune, eliminating the need for the FCD. Why don't people do this??
 
Chris@CCM

Chris@CCM

Member +
ChrisGT said:
Was just wondering as a lot of people run a FCD and SAFC together, but there is really no need then? And you could use a FPR and SAFC together without a FCD, use the SAFC to trim thereby raising fuel cut and get a good tune, eliminating the need for the FCD. Why don't people do this??
Click to expand...
yup u could do that ok u might find u wont even need a rrfpr stock ecus are rich as hell
 
ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
mi16chris said:
yup u could do that ok u might find u wont even need a rrfpr stock ecus are rich as hell
Click to expand...

Yeah that was also my thinking! Without the HKS FCD to lean things out you might not even need the FPR at all as apparently the stock ECU/FPR can run into AFR of 10's ! Worth a shot, might try it over summer; rip out the FCD and fit the SAFC and trim it down, see how it goes!

I just wondered why no one has done this already!? Seems a "safer" way as you don't have the HKS FCD leaning things out, and if the SAFC fails for some reason you'll be running nice and rich (safe.)
 
GT_Irl

GT_Irl

Member +
ChrisGT said:
Yeah that was also my thinking! Without the HKS FCD to lean things out you might not even need the FPR at all as apparently the stock ECU/FPR can run into AFR of 10's ! Worth a shot, might try it over summer; rip out the FCD and fit the SAFC and trim it down, see how it goes!

I just wondered why no one has done this already!? Seems a "safer" way as you don't have the HKS FCD leaning things out, and if the SAFC fails for some reason you'll be running nice and rich (safe.)
Click to expand...

Chris, you may have jus saved me a helluva lot of money! Good lad!:)
 
sx_turbo

sx_turbo

Lifer
people run the rrfpr's aswell, as a safety measure incase the safc breaks.

has happened to 1 or 2 people i've seen.
 
ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
Ricky@JAP MAD said:
people run the rrfpr's aswell, as a safety measure incase the safc breaks.

has happened to 1 or 2 people i've seen.
Click to expand...

Yeah but without a FCD wired in you might not even need a RRFPR because the stock FPR provides enough fuel and theres no HKS FCD to lean things out.

So, if you just had a SAFC (no FCD & no FPR) and were using it to trim fuelling and it were to fail, you would revert back to the stock FPR/ECU which is supposedly very rich anyway.

This all needs to be tested obviously, but a few browses of the Aus forum and here and the stock ECU/FPR fuels into the 10s/11s already. So you could simply fit the SAFC without the RRFPR and trim it back to mid-to-high 11's and raise fuel cut at the same time and make the use of a FCD redundant.

GT_Irl said:
Chris, you may have jus saved me a helluva lot of money! Good lad!:)
Click to expand...

Give it a go! As long as you have a wideband to keep an eye on things you should be fine! All that might be needed is a SAFC...fancy that, no need for a FPR/FCD (possibly a FPR) but even still! lol
 
GT_Irl

GT_Irl

Member +
ChrisGT said:
Yeah but without a FCD wired in you might not even need a RRFPR because the stock FPR provides enough fuel and theres no HKS FCD to lean things out.

So, if you just had a SAFC (no FCD & no FPR) and were using it to trim fuelling and it were to fail, you would revert back to the stock FPR/ECU which is supposedly very rich anyway.

This all needs to be tested obviously, but a few browses of the Aus forum and here and the stock ECU/FPR fuels into the 10s/11s already. So you could simply fit the SAFC without the RRFPR and trim it back to mid-to-high 11's and raise fuel cut at the same time and make the use of a FCD redundant.



Give it a go! As long as you have a wideband to keep an eye on things you should be fine! All that might be needed is a SAFC...fancy that, no need for a FPR/FCD (possibly a FPR) but even still! lol
Click to expand...

It really does make sense when you think about it.... can't believe this hasnt come up before!
 
ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
GT_Irl said:
It really does make sense when you think about it.... can't believe this hasnt come up before!
Click to expand...

Indeed. The guys over on the Aus club really like using the S-AFC / AFCNeo's, even for cars that they want to run standard-ish boost on! Just allows you to tweak the overly rich nature of the stock ECU and get that extra bit of power.

But yeah, they see the SAFC of a way of removing boost cut and tweaking the fuelling. I well want to give it a try when I'm done with uni ! Set the RRFPR back to 2.4Bar, remove the HKS FCD and wire in the SAFC. I wonder if I would be up to tuning the SAFC if I bought a wideband AFR...if not, its £149.99 to get the SAFC road tuned which isn't too bad.
 
GT_Irl

GT_Irl

Member +
ChrisGT said:
Indeed. The guys over on the Aus club really like using the S-AFC / AFCNeo's, even for cars that they want to run standard-ish boost on! Just allows you to tweak the overly rich nature of the stock ECU and get that extra bit of power.

But yeah, they see the SAFC of a way of removing boost cut and tweaking the fuelling. I well want to give it a try when I'm done with uni ! Set the RRFPR back to 2.4Bar, remove the HKS FCD and wire in the SAFC. I wonder if I would be up to tuning the SAFC if I bought a wideband AFR...if not, its £149.99 to get the SAFC road tuned which isn't too bad.
Click to expand...

Im off to scotland for 2 months when I finish uni (college project worth 15 credits of my degree...eek!:eek:), but ya when I get back im definitly gona give this a try!
 
Glanza_cl

Glanza_cl

Member +
Don't no if its a point worth mentioning but the map sensor out of the 3sgte engine works on a 4efte and would increase the fuel cut level to that of a 3sgte which is 1.2 bar so in theory if you ran a SAFC or just a RRFPR with the 3sgte map sensor you could run upto 1.2bar as long as the fueling was ok.

just though i would throw that into the thread as that could be another way round running without a FCD.
 
Jay

Jay

Admin
Please remember that when it comes to tuning the AFR's are only part of the equation. Safe boost level isn't just about your fuelling, you have extra heat to consider and this is usually what does the damage.

A wideband (and some experience to go with it) is highly recommended.
 
Sheldon

Sheldon

Malta Area Rep.
i was told safc is not worth it by someone who knows his stuff on here...

i was really tempted to try it out as they go for 130gbp so not bad... now that i know i can remove my jam bcc its even better lol... i can sell the bcc for 45 i think? or do they go for more? and tune with the safc until i get funds for the megasquirt.

sheldon
 
ChrisGT

ChrisGT

Member +
Glanza_cl said:
Don't no if its a point worth mentioning but the map sensor out of the 3sgte engine works on a 4efte and would increase the fuel cut level to that of a 3sgte which is 1.2 bar so in theory if you ran a SAFC or just a RRFPR with the 3sgte map sensor you could run upto 1.2bar as long as the fueling was ok.

just though i would throw that into the thread as that could be another way round running without a FCD.
Click to expand...

Oh didn't know that.

Jay said:
Please remember that when it comes to tuning the AFR's are only part of the equation. Safe boost level isn't just about your fuelling, you have extra heat to consider and this is usually what does the damage.

A wideband (and some experience to go with it) is highly recommended.
Click to expand...

Yeah I guess AFR/EGT gauges would be needed, chances are I would get someone to set it up for me tbh.

Sheldon said:
i was told safc is not worth it by someone who knows his stuff on here...

i was really tempted to try it out as they go for 130gbp so not bad... now that i know i can remove my jam bcc its even better lol... i can sell the bcc for 45 i think? or do they go for more? and tune with the safc until i get funds for the megasquirt.

sheldon
Click to expand...

Yeah some people say SAFC's are rubbish, but they use them a lot on 200SX's and a number of other cars. Wish I hadn't sold mine! :(
 
Sheldon

Sheldon

Malta Area Rep.
yeah they use them on many cars esp hondas over here. dunno why not on a starlet =/

you used yours? or you had one that you never got round fitting it? if you used it was it easy to setup?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top