Its legal so IO guess talking about it isn't against the rules...
- Thread starter HutchGlanzaV
- Start date
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
Maybe you could tell me what else Afghanistan produces then mate because as far as I'm aware the poppies (or resulting drugs) are their biggest export.
I honestly do think that by legalising what the farmers over there are doing will mean the profits (atleast for the most part) will not end up in the pockets of terrorist organisations. Remember the farmers themselves are not the terrorists, they are merely doing what they can to make a living.
I can't address any of the points in your last paragraph because I don't really know what your trying to get across.
I honestly do think that by legalising what the farmers over there are doing will mean the profits (atleast for the most part) will not end up in the pockets of terrorist organisations. Remember the farmers themselves are not the terrorists, they are merely doing what they can to make a living.
I can't address any of the points in your last paragraph because I don't really know what your trying to get across.
gv1.3
Admin
Where did I say sell it in local corner shops?
My biggest gripe is that people who are anti drugs seem to concentrate on the worst ones like you just did with heroin and cocaine. Obviously you would not be selling these in a local shop that would just be silly. But if people want them they could go to a clinic sign up for a dispensary card and then be able to purchase a certain amount for a very small fee.
Now ask yourself, are you and everyone you know going to go and sign up to get government sold heroin because it is legal? The answer is most probably no. Just like I can quit my job and go get social welfare but I dont want to.
So the net result of this is we can relatively accurately see how many people are using these drugs. We have a contact point with them when they come to buy drugs where we can offer them health services and needle exchanges etc in an attempt to treat them and battle disease.
They are receiving drugs of a known quality and substance making them safer to ingest.
The drugs are mass produced legally by the government and sold with no markup meaning drug dealers have no market and you cut the supply of money to criminal gangs.
So... there is no way to totally eliminate drug addiction but you can try to manage it.
For less harmful drugs I like the approach Amsterdam takes. Its no big deal, its in designated areas and at small amounts and is a social setting much like going for a beer. You can safely walk the streets.
And while we are talking about prostitution again look at Amsterdam. They accept the fact that it is a profession that is never going to go away, ever. So they set aside a geographic location in their city where it is acceptable and strictly enforce this. If people do not want to see prostitutes then dont go to that area. If people do then go to that area.
We should look at the history books and learn from them. When alcohol was banned in the US it didnt stop people drinking. It put the alcohol manufacturing and distribution in to the hands of criminal gangs. It deprived the government of tax revenue and gave criminals the ability to make huge amounts of money, ultimately it was scrapped.
gv1.3
Admin
Good argument. What if you could sit a farmer down and say... "we will build new roads and schools, pay you a decent price for growing legal crops and generally increase the value of your land and improve your quality of life"
Have a look at this article - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/21/AR2009052104318.html
But look at the knock on effect of what I said in my last post would have. If governments manufactured and distributed their own drugs they would eliminate gangs and these farmers would have no reason to grow crops as there would be no market for them.
sacodetoro
Lifer
You are being incredibly nieve, how will legalizing poppy cultivation(not that it will make any difference in Aghanistan) in any way change where the profits go?
The fact is that it won't!
Poppies are their biggest export that is the point, it's their biggest export because that is what is profitable.
A fair trade scheme of some kind would only be put in place to ensure the farmers got a sustainable price for an alternative crop to poppies meaning they could stop farming poppies and move to an alternative crop while maintaining a decent income but at the same time having more stability in their region with better local infrastructure.
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
What alternative crop dude? If Afghan was capable of producing much else do you not think it would be doing so?
sacodetoro
Lifer
Yes read something similar from here
http://afghanistan.usaid.gov/en/Article.86.aspx
If government were to into manufacturing and distribution of any drug would it not be better for them to do it in the current legal field of medincinal drugs.
Rather than paying £40000 for a 6 month course of drugs that cost £25?
Government manufacturing is extremely unlikely in my view and it would need capital investment to come to frooition, the majority of the population would probably be against this investment and manufacturing heroin.
Despite this, in an ideal world the concept would probably be a cheaper one and better for society but an ideal world will never happen and in my view their are too many practical obstacles that would prevent it ever happening or being implemented correctly.
A bit of topic but along the vein of public ownership, I think they should buy an apartment block or old hotel in London and put the MPs up there rather than giviing them massive expenses, sort of similar to what they do in one of the scandinavian countries.
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sacodetoro
Lifer
Have you not read or understood what I have written?
No, it wouldn't be doing so because alternative crops aren't as profitable as poppies unless subsidy shcemes in one form or another are introduced.
I haven't really got time to answer all this, its getting so in depth now i cant be bothered.
all through this debate you have refereed to alcohol which is sold in your local corner shops, so sorry if i have misread you. You haven't once said about prescribing them to junkies that are already hooked. That i can remember, and yes i am referring mainly to the worst ones.
Cannabis is no real biggie i have smoked, still wouldn't want it legalized if im honest.
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
Sorry mate but no I haven't. (That isn't me being awkward and wanting to disagree by the way, I just haven't understood what you've been trying to get across)
Cannabis is just as open to abuse as any drug, but as you see it as "no biggie" why wouldn't you want to see it legalised?
I think the likes of cocaine and heroin and some other drugs are at another level, but like i say i still wouldn't want cannabis legalized! i know people that have to smoke that everyday to get through the day not for me sorry.
gv1.3
Admin
okay.
Alcoholics cant get through the day without a drink, should we ban all people from drinking?
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
Some people have to drink to make it through the day mate and thats perfectly legal. "Not for me" isn't a very valid arguement for whether something should be legal or not. Infact imo "not for me" is exactly the choice we should be given.
Ok you win im no scientist so i dont have facts and figures as to why they might think alcohol is alright to be legal and other substances are not. Im outer this thread and back to some thing i do care about. At the end of the day why are you moaning anyway we all know you can get hold of pretty much anything you wish to ingest. The only reason i first ever commented on this thread was to try and help you lol DRUGS ARE BAD TALK TO FRANK.
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
Its not about winning or losing mate, its about differing opinions and alternative solutions.
sacodetoro
Lifer
HutchGlanzaV said:
Couldn't say it better, it's interesting to hear other peoples views
emmalouise
Fresh Recruit
It tends to be called bubbles if its in a capsule.
but some people still call it that, if its in a bag.
MATTYBYRNEgt2008
Member +
bonzai citrus ftw!!!!!!!!!!!
HutchGlanzaV
Member +
Thats a new one on me! I'm not usually one to take much notice of media scare mongering but there does seem to be an increasing number of deaths linked to this stuff. Becare people.
GTti
Member +
I just got chunky sick all over my hands on the way to the gym.
I looked in her bag whilst she was being sick through her nose and mouth (And let her dangle her arms and legs in it), unfortunately she didn't have any money, but she did have a bottle of PRESCRIBED physeptone. She couldn't speak or move and could barely breathe. I had to prop her against a wall to stop her choking to death on her own vomit.
So anyone itending to try this stuff, don't do 3/4 of the small medication size bottles.
I looked in her bag whilst she was being sick through her nose and mouth (And let her dangle her arms and legs in it), unfortunately she didn't have any money, but she did have a bottle of PRESCRIBED physeptone. She couldn't speak or move and could barely breathe. I had to prop her against a wall to stop her choking to death on her own vomit.
So anyone itending to try this stuff, don't do 3/4 of the small medication size bottles.