Dave's Big Brake Kit Vs Mr Chu's AP Racing Brake Kit

Monkfish

Monkfish

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Just as a recap, these were my old 3G's, which Dave replaced. :)

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Gee

Gee

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Which parts are needed for a gt4 or Levin break setup? And what size rims do they fit under?
 
Ted

Ted

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Monkfish said:
Yes, the braking system is something that shouldn't be bodged or skimped on, but on the flip side I really see a 1k kit as a horrendous waste of money.

It doesn't matter how big or powerful your brakes are, they will only slow the car down as much as the grip in the tyres will permit. Stamp on the pedal at 60-70 on stock disks and pads and you will lock the wheels up. A large braking kit will not slow the car down any faster with exactly the same road and tyre conditions until slower speeds when the stock system has cooked itself. Larger brakes really come into the own at higher speeds when the stock setup cannot lock the wheels up. Larger brake kits are also more efficient, requiring less for to do the same amount of work meaning they can be abused for far longer before showing any signs of fade.

So, what am I doing? I am planning getting 280mm stock disks and 4 pot calipers off an Nissan 200sx s14a. It'll cost me ~£250 for the disks and calipers and ~£100 for brackets to fit them. They will provide more than enough braking power in a car weighing 860 kilo's with 180 bhp, bearing in mind that the stock brakes on an s14a are sufficient for ~300bhp in a car weighing close to 1200 kilo's. The only concern is that the master cylinder won't have the capacity, which is unlikely given that these 1k kits run on the stock master cylinder. I'd also be as bold as to say that a 280mm flat disk is just as efficient as a 300mm grooved one.

So again, why waste 1k on a kit when £350 will do the same job, leaving more money to spend on other mods? :homer:
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well said mate, we are talking about stopping a car weighing 900kg. anything more than 2 pots is overkill. if anyone wants to waste 1000 quid on 4 pots then work away. i lock up my 2 pot celica brakes at any speed i like. i get no fade on any track day. im interested in having a go at fitting st205 brakes (4 pots) to mine just to see whats possible for a couple of hundred quid. will post up when i find out.
 
Monkfish

Monkfish

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Gee said:
Which parts are needed for a gt4 or Levin break setup? And what size rims do they fit under?
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Which GT4, ST185 or ST205?

ST185 front calipers are 2 pots and will fit under 15's. ST205's are 4 pots and are a tad on the large side. I think ST205's had 16's as standard, so you'd need 16's on your Starlet to make sure you've got the space. Spacers might be needed.

ted said:
im interested in having a go at fitting st205 brakes (4 pots) to mine just to see whats possible for a couple of hundred quid. will post up when i find out.
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As above, I think they're a tad on the large side, but I could be wrong. :p
 
Gee

Gee

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Well, I would want them to fit under a 15" rim, so I guess it would be the ST185 :)

What parts are exactly needed?

Calipers
Discs
Pads

??

Sorry for sounding stupid, but I have never even changed a brake pads or discs. Im too scared!
 
Ted

Ted

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calipers,discs,pads,3mm spacer to sit behind disc,longer studs to accomodate for spacer. thats it really.
 
H

Harvey

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No the celica hares the same 131mm spacing so they bolt staright on.

Gee there are 2 types of ST185 GT4 brakes.

Theres a UK one, and 2 types of JDM (early JDM is same as ST165 - 2 pot ~260mm) Late JDM and UK 185 is ~280mm single pot.

The 260mm should fit under some 14's. Will always vary wheel to wheel though. My mazda enkei alloys clear my AW11 calipers my a hairs width! Lile no more then 2-3mm between the caliper and spokes, nearly needed wheel spacers!
 
H

Harvey

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As for the ST205 calipers ive been tempted too but also fear would need 16's! On the ST205 they are 315mm i think. On the AW11 Paul Woods fitted some to the discs had to be machined down to 300mm. Will probably be the same for the starlet. However i still think at 300mm 16's will be a must.
 
ashygt

ashygt

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i've got gt4 setup like teds and they work brilliantly fit behind 15 aswel:-

calipers-celica gt4 st185 earlier model
disks -got mine from ebay off uprated corolla ones(265x22mm grooved and dimpled)
spacers-3mm
 
GTti

GTti

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Monkfish said:
So, what am I doing? I am planning getting 280mm stock disks and 4 pot calipers off an Nissan 200sx s14a.
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The downside to this is that even stock cast calipers are pretty heavy, those from an S14 are going to be heavier still.

With Wilwood Power/Midilites they weigh only a couple of lbs. Depends how mad you are about weight saving, bigger discs will also be more rotational weight ontop.

For me the Powerlites will do, I think these would do for most Starlet owners even though they're rated at about 750~800KG. Only problem is that they don't have dust seals for the road.

Can't complain at £70~80 per caliper!
 
GTti

GTti

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Oh and I'd just to the fronts. Putting anything on the rear is just a waste of time considering less than 30% braking force is applied there.
 
H

Harvey

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And i dont think you could uprate the rears without spending £££ but as you say just not needed.

Yes i have been very tempted by the willwoods in the past its just the dust seal problem that you mention puts me off, becuase i think willwood calipers on 280x22mm discs would be just about perfect for most starlets on track!

If the S14 4 pots are anything like the st205 ones they are aluminium so yes they are not small but wont weigh loads and loads! I want something to fit under 15's tho so i think they are out for me
 
GTti

GTti

Member +
The Midilites have dust seals, it's just the Powerlites. The powerlites would fit under 14's with reasonable disc size (260mm or so), thats why they're tempting, I want alot of rubber :p
 
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