4efe or 4afe box + 4efte in a Corolla E11?

Jay

Admin
Nope, I don't usually open gearboxes.

The term stronger is based purely on experience - a 4EFE box doesn't usually last long in a turbo Starlet.

If it's a rattle at idle which goes away when you put the clutch in it could be a dying release bearing. Definitely a lot cheaper than a replacement gearbox so worth removing and inspecting.
 

Jay

Admin
Could also be a diff bearing giving hassle, heard a few of those start clicking but that was back when you could just go pick up a secondhand gearbox for £70!
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
Exactly. I was hoping to find the gearbox for a few hundred pounds but we are talking about 2000 pounds. The sound I hear ticks only when I accelerate. The noise comes from the front right side but It is not the shaft. I believe it is the gearbox because when I push the clutxh pedal the tranny runs smooth. There is no sound at Ido. You can hear it accelerating without putting your foot on the clutch pedal. The clutch is fine.
 
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If you could get the car up on a ramp it might help pinpoint the noise - stick it in gear and spin the wheels.
i agree,,,and then if required, get the gearbox off to see what is actually going on.
you may be thinking its the gearbox when it could be the clutch, throw out bearing, fork or pressure/plate failing,,,you won't know for sure until you remove the box...save your money until you know the exact issue,,,but in the meantime you can shop around for the potential parts needed, so you know the exact locations/costs of potential replacements
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
If you could get the car up on a ramp it might help pinpoint the noise - stick it in gear and spin the wheels.
Yes I did that already on the bridge and the funny noise comes from the transmission. It is not the drive shaft. Today I’ve ordered a E.P 82 non LSD gearbox. All I am trying to figure out is if the Corolla 4efe drive shafts will of course fit the gearbox but most of all will be the same length. Do you have this information for me?
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
i agree,,,and then if required, get the gearbox off to see what is actually going on.
you may be thinking its the gearbox when it could be the clutch, throw out bearing, fork or pressure/plate failing,,,you won't know for sure until you remove the box...save your money until you know the exact issue,,,but in the meantime you can shop around for the potential parts needed, so you know the exact locations/costs of potential replacements
That is a wise suggestion. It is what I did ever since I started the project. The fact that I am in Italy doesn’t help me with the Japanese parts that you guys have access to. @Jay always told me that the turbo engine gearbox is stronger and it is better to use that one on the turbo engine instead of the 4EFE corolla gearbox. The turbo gearbox probably has bigger components that make it stronger.
I will get the gearbox off when I will swap it with the EP 82 gearbox I bought today from England. Why did I buy this gearbox? Because I want to swap the transmission with a KAAZ LSD. right now I need to find the workshop manual for the gearbox disassemble/assemble. I will be happy to buy it from eBay but I cannot find it. Can you help?
 
That is a wise suggestion. It is what I did ever since I started the project. The fact that I am in Italy doesn’t help me with the Japanese parts that you guys have access to. @Jay always told me that the turbo engine gearbox is stronger and it is better to use that one on the turbo engine instead of the 4EFE corolla gearbox. The turbo gearbox probably has bigger components that make it stronger.
I will get the gearbox off when I will swap it with the EP 82 gearbox I bought today from England. Why did I buy this gearbox? Because I want to swap the transmission with a KAAZ LSD. right now I need to find the workshop manual for the gearbox disassemble/assemble. I will be happy to buy it from eBay but I cannot find it. Can you help?
jay has given you sound advice

is this ep82 box from the turbo or n/a model?..the differential may be different between the 2 models..6 hole n/a vs 8 hole turbo,,,

yes, the turbo box is said to be stronger, with longer ratios to match a turbo application (that's debatable depending on your specific requirements)...please note, all turbo boxes are now well up there in age and some may need reconditioning (synchros, bearings, etc.),,,especially if the prior usage was dragging, racing, or other driving abuse

as you can see, the 4efe gearbox will work,,,and can work for a long time IF in decent condition and driven sensibly



on a side note, the 4age c52/56 gearbox may fit as well, but will require modifications--bellhousing swap and holes being drilled/tapped...just putting options out there as gearboxes and parts become harder to acquire over the years
 

Badmoon

Member +
Hi!
Was reading this thread and just wanted to say that every 4efe gearbox should be a perfect fit in the 4efte engine, don't know about their strenght though. I've been using the Corolla G6 gearbox in my 4efte for the last 10 years, it was straight bolt on and never gave me any problem. I also like this gearbox short gears for the roads I use but in the end that all comes down to a matter of personal taste.
Good luck!
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
jay has given you sound advice

is this ep82 box from the turbo or n/a model?..the differential may be different between the 2 models..6 hole n/a vs 8 hole turbo,,,

yes, the turbo box is said to be stronger, with longer ratios to match a turbo application (that's debatable depending on your specific requirements)...please note, all turbo boxes are now well up there in age and some may need reconditioning (synchros, bearings, etc.),,,especially if the prior usage was dragging, racing, or other driving abuse

as you can see, the 4efe gearbox will work,,,and can work for a long time IF in decent condition and driven sensibly



on a side note, the 4age c52/56 gearbox may fit as well, but will require modifications--bellhousing swap and holes being drilled/tapped...just putting options out there as gearboxes and parts become harder to acquire over the years
The gearbox comes from a ep82 Glanza 4efte. My engine is a ep91 4efte. Will the bell housing be both on?
The only reason I am buying it is because I can put the KAAZ LSD in, that otherwise I cannot do with the 4EFE C140-150.
Considering that my car is heavier compared to the Starlet I believe that the shorter gears make the engine suffer less. If you cannot compare the two open gearboxes and see what makes them different. The only thing we can say is that those who have the turbo gearbox never had a problem.
So I would pay 720 euros for the C140 compared to 680 pounds for the C56 ep82 non LSD. What do you suggest?
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
Hi!
Was reading this thread and just wanted to say that every 4efe gearbox should be a perfect fit in the 4efte engine, don't know about their strenght though. I've been using the Corolla G6 gearbox in my 4efte for the last 10 years, it was straight bolt on and never gave me any problem. I also like this gearbox short gears for the roads I use but in the end that all comes down to a matter of personal taste.
Good luck!
My Corolla gearbox has 250k Km and probably it is Time to change it. I found a refurbished one for €720. The turbo gearbox will not be refurbished it will cost me 680 pound. I have to decide tonight because I need to order it.
 

Badmoon

Member +
My Corolla gearbox has 250k Km and probably it is Time to change it. I found a refurbished one for €720. The turbo gearbox will not be refurbished it will cost me 680 pound. I have to decide tonight because I need to order it.
My C161 has around the same kms as yours and I don't see any problem with it or why should it be changed because of its kms. Maybe its just the release bearing that needs changing and is good as new again but you need to take it out to check. Its a wear part and saves you the money of buying a new gearbox. I would get it checked first if I were you. Also have you ever changed the gearbox oil? I had a gearbox grinding on some gears and after changing the oil it was much better.
 

Frankieflowers

Member +
My C161 has around the same kms as yours and I don't see any problem with it or why should it be changed because of its kms. Maybe its just the release bearing that needs changing and is good as new again but you need to take it out to check. Its a wear part and saves you the money of buying a new gearbox. I would get it checked first if I were you. Also have you ever changed the gearbox oil? I had a gearbox grinding on some gears and after changing the oil it was much better.
We changed the oil the other day and it’s nice and clean. The clutch is brand new and it has maximum 10,000 km. Lately I had a problem shifting and the gears wouldn’t get in. Any gear. It means that there is a major problem inside maybe the forks are consumed. They asked me 1000 and €300 to refurbish it. To buy it refurbished it cost €720. This is why I thought to buy the turbo gearbox for 680 pounds.
 

Badmoon

Member +
We changed the oil the other day and it’s nice and clean. The clutch is brand new and it has maximum 10,000 km. Lately I had a problem shifting and the gears wouldn’t get in. Any gear. It means that there is a major problem inside maybe the forks are consumed. They asked me 1000 and €300 to refurbish it. To buy it refurbished it cost €720. This is why I thought to buy the turbo gearbox for 680 pounds.
Well that symptom can tell me yet another problem which I already had in my Corolla... Clutch master cylinder... Had the same symptom and it was the problem at the time.
In my BJ40 had the same problem and when we swaped the master cylinder for a new one we came to see the slave cylinder was also with problems so I had to swap both, until now no more problems. So if its hard shifting gears in yours, or not possible at all, I would check those 2 components too.
About the clutch, it can be almost new but have the other parts been changed at the time?
So as I see it, could be clutch release bearing, clutch master cylinder or clutch slave cylinder, if not any of those then I would go to a gearbox problem.
 
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Frankieflowers

Member +
So if its hard shifting
Let’s say shifting is fine 80% of the time. The problem comes suddenly, sometimes at the red light after waiting I try to put the 1st gear in bit it’s impossible until I have to force it in. It gets worse when the engine is warm and I am parking the car. I feel ot getting hard like the forks don’t work properly and the shaft feels weird. After trying to get the reverse gear in i hear the bad noise like you put the gear in without stopping the car first. This sounds like a clutch problem. On top of this when I accelerate and drop the gas pedal I hear to “tock tock” sound coming from the gearbox. I might aHave both problems. Now, should ai buy the 4efe refurbished gearbox or should ai buy the turbo ep82 gearbox? Let me knel what you think. Thanks!
 

Badmoon

Member +
The problem comes suddenly, sometimes at the red light after waiting I try to put the 1st gear in bit it’s impossible until I have to force it in. It gets worse when the engine is warm
Same problem I had, it was the clutch master cylinder in my case and after swaping for a new one never happenned again, its been around 12 years since then. Many times if I stopped in a red light with my foot in the clutch pedal and first gear engaged waiting for the green it was like I was slowly releasing it and the car started to move, which turned to dangerous situations... You also say that in your case it gets worse after everything gets up to normal operating temperature, mine was also like that. Does not mean you don't have another problem or the gearbox is somehow really damaged, I'm just letting you know what my problem was at the time and how it was fixed. So make the best decision for you, this is my experience based on something very similar to what you say.
About the gearbox, if you want to buy another one I'm a bit suspicious on my opinion as I really love my C161, if I was to get a 5 speed one I would choose based on its price as you already know what yours was like and the abuse it took along the years. Is one stronger than the other? I don't know but it can also be something related to abuse or being worn... You also never know the state in which the turbo one will be and the refurbished at least guarantees you its good to run. Also you're a bit unlucky about the turbo gearbox as I had mine in my garage for the last 10 years, from when I imported my engine, never used it... Sold only its inside parts last month to a guy in Ireland which was having lots of problems with his gearbox so was cheaper to send. Still have the bellhousing for sale if you somehow need it.
 
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