The great 5E v 4E timing debate.

[hardcoreep]

Not necessarily, because I've run 5EFHE cams in my car and the 4E timing mark worked better for me.

 

[Gtstu]

just a thought,

if you are using 5e head and cams the timing needs to be setup on the 5e marks.

if you are using 4e head and cams maybe you need to use the 4e markers?

arnt they pretty much the same tho?

 

[sx_turbo]

so why the 2 different timing marks, there is a reason for the different marks, and i would and can only assume it is dependent on what cylinder head you use.

 

[Gtstu]

im pretty sure its the same head the marks are to determine when the the engine is at tdc ?

 

[goldenvtr]

im pretty sure its the same head the marks are to determine when the the engine is at tdc ?

nope. TDC is deermind by the crank pulley which stays at TDC when your changing between the 4e and 5e marks, the only diffrence it does it change when the vavles open and close.

4e marks seem to keep the gas flow more smooth and 5e make it more harsh and punchy (from my experiance of driving these setups)

 

[munday]

so why the 2 different timing marks, there is a reason for the different marks, and i would and can only assume it is dependent on what cylinder head you use.

Well one big difference is the 4e is a low compression turbo and the 5e is a higher compression NA, thats why they use different timing marks

 

[billybob]

Well one big difference is the 4e is a low compression turbo and the 5e is a higher compression NA, thats why they use different timing marks

that seems to make sence so the turbo should come on quicker with the 5e marks mybe

 

[Gtstu]

it would be more punchey due to the higher compression and more responsive but how would it handle high boost pressures?

 

[goldenvtr]

that seems to make sence so the turbo should come on quicker with the 5e marks mybe

it definatly come in harsher lol i should of recorded a 3rd gear run on the 4e mark before changing.

on a fully setup car would changing the cam timming result in needing an a/f change?? if not then i may do some proper data log when the ultimate is fitted....

 

[ramses974]

hey guys
my friend and mine have experimented a lot of mix with the 4e and 5e mark...
i have a 4e with 5EFHE cams in it...i will tell you what is the more agressive set up when i will get my car...my car is not with me..for painting...:homer:

 

[weeJohn]

I dont have a 5e so I am only thinking out loud here.

Is there any difference in the 5e distributor compared to the 4e distributor, as far as the location of the rotor arm to the spline that locates in the exhaust cam?

Does the 5e distributor have the coilpack built into it like the 4e n/a`s? It could be that on the 5e marks the 5e dizzy rotor points directly to the centre of the 5e dizzy cap No.1 lead contact, but on the 4e dizzy its slightly off.

Maybe the difference in timing is not down the the position of the cams but the position of the distributor, as from memory the 5e and 4e marks are a long way apart on the sprocket, its a big difference in valve position compared to stroke.

If the coilpack is trying to fire into a wrongly lined up distributor you might only be getting a part spark, and its getting cut off by running out of rotor/dizzy cap contact.

 

[sx_turbo]

Well one big difference is the 4e is a low compression turbo and the 5e is a higher compression NA, thats why they use different timing marks

you dont use the 5e timing mark on the n/a 4e though

 

[weakboy2]

there is different marks because the 5e is a longer block with a longer stroke, so you use the 5e timing marks with the longer belt for a 5e (in theory) to get the correct valve overlap on tdc

 

[billybob]

its starting to get confusing

 

[wheeler]

Well on my 5e I'm running the 4e head, cams ( totally modified ) and 4e distributor, and can agree that it's really aggressive or harsher......... if that makes any sense

 

[weakboy2]

4e head is the same as a 5e head, the difference is the cams, but as said before the reason for the two marks is that the actual 5e block is taller than the 4e.

 

[AzE_B]

4e head is the same as a 5e head, the difference is the cams, but as said before the reason for the two marks is that the actual 5e block is taller than the 4e.

When I changed mine from 5e to 4e it felt 50 bhp more as well

it dosent matter how tall the block is 2 turns of the crank will aways be 1 turn of the cams

 

[gorganl2000]

When I changed mine from 5e to 4e it felt 50 bhp more as well

hey aze-b...could you clarify this line here....i dont fully understand what you are trying to say

and...from my expereinces, the 4efte and 5efhe have the same head, even have the same rev limit at 7200rpm (yes, the glanza is slightly higher)

also, from comparing the 4efte and 5efhe distributor, both look the same to me.....i dont know if they have different part numbers

the guys that made big power on turbo 5Es over here tended to favor the "4E" timing mark on the cams..........some have also run 5E marking, but i dont have a lot fo feedback on it

i think the US guys run the 5E marking also on their 5efhte builds...and made some big power also

who knows:haha:

 

[weakboy2]

When I changed mine from 5e to 4e it felt 50 bhp more as well

it dosent matter how tall the block is 2 turns of the crank will aways be 1 turn of the cams

Only if the belt is the correct length, and as the belt is longer that is the reason for the different timing marks, i aint fussed about what is more powerful or not, just saying the marks are there for the correct timing of each engine.

Because that is what ppl are asking about.

 

[AzE_B]

Only if the belt is the correct length, and as the belt is longer that is the reason for the different timing marks, i aint fussed about what is more powerful or not, just saying the marks are there for the correct timing of each engine.

Because that is what ppl are asking about.

its dosnt matter the length of the belt its alway going to be 2 turns crank 1 turn on the cams